New Air Compressor not performing
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New Air Compressor not performing
Hi... I need some input on a situation concerning my new Air Compressor...
I just don't think it's performing as rated CFM wise.
Read this when ya have time,it got kinda long.
Thanks in advance for any input.
I have purchased a Speedaire model 1nnf6 belt drive..120v 15A, 2hp constant (surge unknown),Twin Cylinder,5.5 cfm @90 psi. w/20 gal tank. The motor specs to turn @ 3450 rpm.These are labeled to be from the Dayton Air folks.
Theres a couple of things that make me fill something just aint right........ I'm not a big user of air compressors.
Up until now all I've owned (to get by for filling tires) was the smaller direct drive types. I learned that they just don't last.
After putting everything together,and going out and buying a quart of (Mobil 1) yeah.... Compressor oil just want do,for Speedaire.......
By the way...this was the maiden startup...
I hadn't started it sense I got it new (about a week).
Wasn't any sense in running it just to hear it run.
I started this baby up,and right off,noticed,that the pulley on the electric motor end sure seemed to be turning slow...
By just me eye balling it,it looks more like something in the 1800 range,sure not even close to 3450....
It has about a 3 inch pulley on the motor end,and at 3450 it should be nothing but a blur.
I can easily see the spokes turning in the pulley.
Anyway ... I let her run....(30sec or so),before the pressure gauge ever started to move.It took awhile to finally top that 20 gal tank at 125psi...It eventually got there.
I started the compressor up on this day,because I had just finished using my miter saw,and was gonna blow all the saw dust away.... This was all outside under my shed........
Now back to the compressor seemingly running slow...
I had removed the air filter,because it seemed to take so long to pressure that tank up.While it was initially pressuring up,is when I took the air filter off.I put my two fingers over the intake hole,and there was just barely any suction at all...
It surely wasn't enough to pull your fingers to it...
I would think there should be a lot more suction,on the intake side....but I don't know... So this is one of my questions..
One of the reasons,I bought this model,was the rated 3450 rpm.... and the 5.5cfm @90psi... I figured 3450 was pretty fast for a belt drive,and it being a twin cylinder it sure should be able to keep up cfm wise....
Well.....wrong again.....
I went ahead and connected,my air hose,and the small blow gun end....to do the saw dust removal...
I found out pretty quick that this compressor will not keep up with the blow gun.
Now this short 5" blow gun don't have but a 1/8" hole at the nozzle.
The compressor want hold a steady cfm displacement,with the blow gun open until it drops to 70psi.... It will then keep up and hold at 70.
However it sure want at 125 psi...even with the 20 gal tank,it falls fast...the compressor kicks in at 90psi,then it keeps falling till it reaches 70,it levels out there and stays up with the blow gun discharge.
Maybe I'm not being rational with my judgment here.
Maybe that blow gun is quite a load on discharge.
However,I don't see how it could be any more than say a 1/2 drive impact wrench.. My idea of 5.5 cfm @ 90psi,must not be the same as the builders.
Maybe they built this for cubic inches per minute.
Instead of cubic feet,and all my tools are for cubic feet.
I have got to figure out how to check the motor rpm,and the cfm displacement of this motor/pump combo.
If it want do 5.5 cfm @ 90,(as advertised),I surely don't want it,and aint gonna have it.
This comes from Grainger,almost exclusively.
For $429 plus tax... It's sure a puny compressor.
If you have been around compressors,you know the typical sound of what you would call the slow running type.
Well that sound, is the speed from this compressor.
It sure don't sound like 3450 at all.It just lopes along.....
My old small direct drive compressor turned in the 3000 range,and this is way way slower than that.
Does any of this sound like it's in line with what should be ??
I apologize for the lengthiness.
I'm gonna chk the amp draw,and if I have any room to play with....... I'll be changing that motor pulley,to a larger one.
Trying to get the pump to do some work,instead of jogging along,putt,putt,putt...... I'll put that Mobil 1 to good use.
If ya made it this far.... this thing sucks,but it don't suck in the right way....... It don't suck air...!
But hey..... It's pretty.... I'll give it that much.
Any replies welcomed.....
I just don't think it's performing as rated CFM wise.
Read this when ya have time,it got kinda long.
Thanks in advance for any input.
I have purchased a Speedaire model 1nnf6 belt drive..120v 15A, 2hp constant (surge unknown),Twin Cylinder,5.5 cfm @90 psi. w/20 gal tank. The motor specs to turn @ 3450 rpm.These are labeled to be from the Dayton Air folks.
Theres a couple of things that make me fill something just aint right........ I'm not a big user of air compressors.
Up until now all I've owned (to get by for filling tires) was the smaller direct drive types. I learned that they just don't last.
After putting everything together,and going out and buying a quart of (Mobil 1) yeah.... Compressor oil just want do,for Speedaire.......
By the way...this was the maiden startup...
I hadn't started it sense I got it new (about a week).
Wasn't any sense in running it just to hear it run.
I started this baby up,and right off,noticed,that the pulley on the electric motor end sure seemed to be turning slow...
By just me eye balling it,it looks more like something in the 1800 range,sure not even close to 3450....
It has about a 3 inch pulley on the motor end,and at 3450 it should be nothing but a blur.
I can easily see the spokes turning in the pulley.
Anyway ... I let her run....(30sec or so),before the pressure gauge ever started to move.It took awhile to finally top that 20 gal tank at 125psi...It eventually got there.
I started the compressor up on this day,because I had just finished using my miter saw,and was gonna blow all the saw dust away.... This was all outside under my shed........
Now back to the compressor seemingly running slow...
I had removed the air filter,because it seemed to take so long to pressure that tank up.While it was initially pressuring up,is when I took the air filter off.I put my two fingers over the intake hole,and there was just barely any suction at all...
It surely wasn't enough to pull your fingers to it...
I would think there should be a lot more suction,on the intake side....but I don't know... So this is one of my questions..
One of the reasons,I bought this model,was the rated 3450 rpm.... and the 5.5cfm @90psi... I figured 3450 was pretty fast for a belt drive,and it being a twin cylinder it sure should be able to keep up cfm wise....
Well.....wrong again.....
I went ahead and connected,my air hose,and the small blow gun end....to do the saw dust removal...
I found out pretty quick that this compressor will not keep up with the blow gun.
Now this short 5" blow gun don't have but a 1/8" hole at the nozzle.
The compressor want hold a steady cfm displacement,with the blow gun open until it drops to 70psi.... It will then keep up and hold at 70.
However it sure want at 125 psi...even with the 20 gal tank,it falls fast...the compressor kicks in at 90psi,then it keeps falling till it reaches 70,it levels out there and stays up with the blow gun discharge.
Maybe I'm not being rational with my judgment here.
Maybe that blow gun is quite a load on discharge.
However,I don't see how it could be any more than say a 1/2 drive impact wrench.. My idea of 5.5 cfm @ 90psi,must not be the same as the builders.
Maybe they built this for cubic inches per minute.
Instead of cubic feet,and all my tools are for cubic feet.
I have got to figure out how to check the motor rpm,and the cfm displacement of this motor/pump combo.
If it want do 5.5 cfm @ 90,(as advertised),I surely don't want it,and aint gonna have it.
This comes from Grainger,almost exclusively.
For $429 plus tax... It's sure a puny compressor.
If you have been around compressors,you know the typical sound of what you would call the slow running type.
Well that sound, is the speed from this compressor.
It sure don't sound like 3450 at all.It just lopes along.....
My old small direct drive compressor turned in the 3000 range,and this is way way slower than that.
Does any of this sound like it's in line with what should be ??
I apologize for the lengthiness.
I'm gonna chk the amp draw,and if I have any room to play with....... I'll be changing that motor pulley,to a larger one.
Trying to get the pump to do some work,instead of jogging along,putt,putt,putt...... I'll put that Mobil 1 to good use.
If ya made it this far.... this thing sucks,but it don't suck in the right way....... It don't suck air...!
But hey..... It's pretty.... I'll give it that much.
Any replies welcomed.....
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.....That thought occured ...
The thought occurred that maybe it's wired for 220v,however it didn't linger long.
I figured it wouldn't run at all if that was the case.
I'm no electrician....
The motor has a cover plate,on the rear (easily accessible ) for allowing access to swap from 110v to 220v wiring pattern.
For me,just taking a look,I wouldn't know what I was looking at.
If anyone with an electrical training background reads this,and has a comment,as to if the motor would run on 110v,after being wired for 220v,please let me know.
I figured it wouldn't run at all if that was the case.
I'm no electrician....
The motor has a cover plate,on the rear (easily accessible ) for allowing access to swap from 110v to 220v wiring pattern.
For me,just taking a look,I wouldn't know what I was looking at.
If anyone with an electrical training background reads this,and has a comment,as to if the motor would run on 110v,after being wired for 220v,please let me know.
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As far as the blow gun goes... depending on what you have you could be putting 20-25 cfm into the atmosphere. No 5.5 cfm compressor will keep up. And it sounds like there is nothing wrong with it.
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markiz37 .........
To reply to your reply....
Today has been busy trying to get thoughts and facts organized.
I had posted on the Electrical side of questions,asking about the in's and out's mostly,of behavior with the possibility of this thing being wired incorrectly.
Ole Furd,pushed me to go check the motor wiring.
I had already taken a look with the cover removed,and going by the drawing that's on the side of the motor,had given up trying to follow the drawing...
I had to go by numbers... 1 thru 4,and determine where the color coded wires were connected.
I couldn't see any numbers at all marking each connection point.
Not wanting to be shamed too much,I went and got a flashlight,and my 4x glass,sure enough the connection points are all numbered..
This is a white (apparently plastic),connection board,and all of the numbers are embossed,and hard to see/read.
End result..... the motor is wired correctly for 110v.
I had already considered the idea that the blow gun was just too air hungry,in what it would dispense.
So.....the air gun being allowed to run wide open,and checking the ability for the compressor,was just a lark of a test....
After all,I don't have 50HP motor and a 200 gal tank,running on 440v.
It had no real basis in the real world of air and tool requirements.
With this in mind... I then went and got my most air hungry tool.....1/2 impact driver........
I determined that at 125psi the compressor would indeed supply the needs,as far as real world use would be realized.
Meaning the compressor kept up well enough in my opinion,
as far as any real use that I would ask of it via this impact wrench...
After all,I doubt I'd have the impact wrench wide open for mins on end,with no stopping..
By the way..... The blow gun,did dispense much faster than this impact wrench..... Now we know.....
I had called the Speedaire warranty center earlier on,to insert my findings about this compressors CFM output,and to see what they had to say.
I was asked if I had allowed the compressor to run,for at least 45 mins total with no load (tank dump open) to allow the rings a chance to seat...
I answered (No)....
The manual didn't say anything about doing this..
However it does seem to make sense.
So today,I let it run,for 25 mns,non stop.
2morrow I'll let it run again....for 25 mins.
I'll try to ascertain as to if this made any diff.
I still think it should have more suction at the intake,than it does. .......... but
In any case....finding out that the motor is wired correctly,at least eases some performance questions.
It did do ok,with the 1/2" impact..
It took a good long blast,to kick the motor on.
Far longer than I'd ever actually expect to have the impact pounding away at some work.
One thing I did notice... thats off topic....
Is the fact that,after the 25 mins of running.
The oil sight glass,now shows some pretty dirty looking oil.
As mentioned originally,I have a 10-30 Mobil 1,in the pump crankcase,so I hope that after my next shot at 25 mins of continual running,the oil doesn't get as dirty as fast.
I'll change the oil,after the next 25 min run.
Just to be on the safe side of having oil contaminated with metal.
Something I didn't expect,was to see the oil that dark dirty looking.
It looks like a motor oil at 6000 miles or more.
I have no idea where the discoloring came from.
That is,I mean there is no carbon from fuel combustion per se,so I'm a little shocked.......
As I stated,I'm hoping that as time goes by,the oil doesn't show so much contamination so fast...
I'll be doing a magnet test,with the old oil just to see what all it comes up with.
If after this initial oil change,I notice a continuation of contamination at this same rate...
I will pull the head,pull the pistons,(if need be)and apply a nice three inch circular magnet to the bottom of the crankcase.
That is if room allows.....for good clearance,of the crankshaft.
I have a super strong one that came from a old car speaker.
Once it connects to a flat surface,it's a booger to pull lose.
If I can find a good placement,in there it should serve well,at collecting for the rest of my days.....
However this being a typical splash lube setup,there may not be enough room to allow this idea to actually evolve.
I really don't understand though,why the oil is so dark burnt contaminated looking.
It looks just like old motor oil from a combustion engine.
Maybe it's from some kind of rust preventative coating from the factory..... I just hope it's not from rust.
One plus...Is that on the plate on the motor,under (Duty cycle.)
It states "continuous" ....
I hope it holds up.
In any case .... we live and learn.
Experience = The Test always coming before the Lesson.
It looks like I'll be keeping the compressor.
Thanks to all ......... for any input ...
Today has been busy trying to get thoughts and facts organized.
I had posted on the Electrical side of questions,asking about the in's and out's mostly,of behavior with the possibility of this thing being wired incorrectly.
Ole Furd,pushed me to go check the motor wiring.
I had already taken a look with the cover removed,and going by the drawing that's on the side of the motor,had given up trying to follow the drawing...
I had to go by numbers... 1 thru 4,and determine where the color coded wires were connected.
I couldn't see any numbers at all marking each connection point.
Not wanting to be shamed too much,I went and got a flashlight,and my 4x glass,sure enough the connection points are all numbered..
This is a white (apparently plastic),connection board,and all of the numbers are embossed,and hard to see/read.
End result..... the motor is wired correctly for 110v.
I had already considered the idea that the blow gun was just too air hungry,in what it would dispense.
So.....the air gun being allowed to run wide open,and checking the ability for the compressor,was just a lark of a test....
After all,I don't have 50HP motor and a 200 gal tank,running on 440v.
It had no real basis in the real world of air and tool requirements.
With this in mind... I then went and got my most air hungry tool.....1/2 impact driver........
I determined that at 125psi the compressor would indeed supply the needs,as far as real world use would be realized.
Meaning the compressor kept up well enough in my opinion,
as far as any real use that I would ask of it via this impact wrench...
After all,I doubt I'd have the impact wrench wide open for mins on end,with no stopping..
By the way..... The blow gun,did dispense much faster than this impact wrench..... Now we know.....
I had called the Speedaire warranty center earlier on,to insert my findings about this compressors CFM output,and to see what they had to say.
I was asked if I had allowed the compressor to run,for at least 45 mins total with no load (tank dump open) to allow the rings a chance to seat...
I answered (No)....
The manual didn't say anything about doing this..
However it does seem to make sense.
So today,I let it run,for 25 mns,non stop.
2morrow I'll let it run again....for 25 mins.
I'll try to ascertain as to if this made any diff.
I still think it should have more suction at the intake,than it does. .......... but
In any case....finding out that the motor is wired correctly,at least eases some performance questions.
It did do ok,with the 1/2" impact..
It took a good long blast,to kick the motor on.
Far longer than I'd ever actually expect to have the impact pounding away at some work.
One thing I did notice... thats off topic....
Is the fact that,after the 25 mins of running.
The oil sight glass,now shows some pretty dirty looking oil.
As mentioned originally,I have a 10-30 Mobil 1,in the pump crankcase,so I hope that after my next shot at 25 mins of continual running,the oil doesn't get as dirty as fast.
I'll change the oil,after the next 25 min run.
Just to be on the safe side of having oil contaminated with metal.
Something I didn't expect,was to see the oil that dark dirty looking.
It looks like a motor oil at 6000 miles or more.
I have no idea where the discoloring came from.
That is,I mean there is no carbon from fuel combustion per se,so I'm a little shocked.......
As I stated,I'm hoping that as time goes by,the oil doesn't show so much contamination so fast...
I'll be doing a magnet test,with the old oil just to see what all it comes up with.
If after this initial oil change,I notice a continuation of contamination at this same rate...
I will pull the head,pull the pistons,(if need be)and apply a nice three inch circular magnet to the bottom of the crankcase.
That is if room allows.....for good clearance,of the crankshaft.
I have a super strong one that came from a old car speaker.
Once it connects to a flat surface,it's a booger to pull lose.
If I can find a good placement,in there it should serve well,at collecting for the rest of my days.....
However this being a typical splash lube setup,there may not be enough room to allow this idea to actually evolve.
I really don't understand though,why the oil is so dark burnt contaminated looking.
It looks just like old motor oil from a combustion engine.
Maybe it's from some kind of rust preventative coating from the factory..... I just hope it's not from rust.
One plus...Is that on the plate on the motor,under (Duty cycle.)
It states "continuous" ....
I hope it holds up.
In any case .... we live and learn.
Experience = The Test always coming before the Lesson.
It looks like I'll be keeping the compressor.
Thanks to all ......... for any input ...