Need some advice... Outlet/cord leading to the shed is getting hot...

[JasonG31]

Ok I am running a orange extension cord out to my shed. My wife noticed this afternoon that the outlet this cord was plugged into was warm. She plugged something of hers into it and when she unplugged it, it was burning hot.

Now that she has unplugged her item, its warm still but not burning.

In the shed I am using up-to 30+ amps worth of juice at any given time. I am looking to expand the shed more and I may need more amps.

I do plan on in the future running wires from the breaker underground, but for now during the winter how can I up the juice to the shed and not encounter hot plugs and outlets?

Bigger extension cord? Would that stop the outlet from getting out? Its a normal run of the mill outlet on the outside of the house.

Can I rig a breaker in the shed and power it with the extension cord and split the amp usage that way?

Thoughts? Ideas?

Please help....

[ibpooks]

Originally Posted by JasonG31

Now that she has unplugged her item, its warm still but not burning.

The overheating has probably damaged the receptacle or the wiring in the box. At the very least the box needs to be opened up and inspected the wiring and receptacle.

In the shed I am using up-to 30+ amps worth of juice at any given time. I am looking to expand the shed more and I may need more amps.

Over one orange drop cord? I'm surprised you didn't start a fire. How did you calculate the amp load? What tools are being used?

A general-purpose receptacle should never be used for more than 15A if wired with #14 wire or 20A if wired with #12 wire. Do you have the correct size breaker or fuse on this circuit?

I do plan on in the future running wires from the breaker underground, but for now during the winter how can I up the juice to the shed and not encounter hot plugs and outlets?

A properly sized underground feeder is the only safe way to do it. Either that or limit your power usage to the maximum safe level of the cord and circuit.

Can I rig a breaker in the house and power it with the extension cord and split the amp usage that way?

Forget the extension cord idea. You need an underground feeder to a subpanel in the shop. If you let use know what types of tools you are using we can help you pick the size subpanel you need.

[JasonG31]

I calculated the amp load by figuring out how many watts I was using and dividing it by 12....

Is there another way?

I would install another slot in the breaker for the right wattage and amps... but the breaker has all its slots taken. Maybe I should just replace the whole breaker box with extra space for this and the future?

[ibpooks]

Originally Posted by JasonG31

dividing it by 12....

Did you mean 120?

Is there another way?

I should have been more clear. Are you using an actual measured value or adding up the wattage ratings on the nameplates of the equipment? Depending on the type of equipment the nameplate rating may be the maximum power not the typical power so it's important to distinguish. There is also an issue that the advertising of a "5 HP Compressor" printed on the package usually only is about a 1.5 HP motor, so it matters where the numbers come from too.

I would install another slot in the breaker for the right wattage and amps... but the breaker has all its slots taken. Maybe I should just replace the whole breaker box with extra space for this and the future?

Usually a subpanel feeder of this size would be 240V requiring a double-pole breaker and a four conductor underground feeder. If the main panel is full, you may need to install a subpanel or you may be able to install tandem "skinny" breakers to save some space. If you let us know the make and model of the main panel we may be able to determine if tandem breakers are allowed in that panel.

[JasonG31]

Originally Posted by ibpooks

Did you mean 120?



I should have been more clear. Are you using an actual measured value or adding up the wattage ratings on the nameplates of the equipment? Depending on the type of equipment the nameplate rating may be the maximum power not the typical power so it's important to distinguish. There is also an issue that the advertising of a "5 HP Compressor" printed on the package usually only is about a 1.5 HP motor, so it matters where the numbers come from too.



Usually a subpanel feeder of this size would be 240V requiring a double-pole breaker and a four conductor underground feeder. If the main panel is full, you may need to install a subpanel or you may be able to install tandem "skinny" breakers to save some space. If you let us know the make and model of the main panel we may be able to determine if tandem breakers are allowed in that panel.

Thank you so much... I was using 12...LOL Should of been 120v...

Right now I am maxing out the outlet at 15 amps...

I am running some tools, an electric heater 24/7 for the winter, and other appliances off of the outlet. So its not at 15amps 24/7... but gets up there... This doesnt count what the rest of the circuit is running that this outlet is piggyed off of either... just some small stuff like a light and microwave on another outlet in the circut.

I can get the make of the panel when I get home for you.

Maybe I would be best just rewiring this outlet to a 20 amp circuit near by that runs the stove?

[pcboss]

You just cannot change the breaker size unless all the wiring on the circuit can be properly protected by it. It would be rare for someone to install 20 amp rated wire with a 15 amp breaker. Were you to upsize the breaker you could lead to a fire.

Given the loads you are talking about I am surprised you are not tripping the breaker on a regular basis.

You are also increasing the current draw through voltage drop in the cord. This increases the heat and will damage the insulation and could lead to a fire as Ben has said.

[JasonG31]

Yeah I am not going to upsize the breaker. I was refering to moving the outlet to a different circuit with a 20amp breaker.

As for the panel's info it is

Square D Company
Issue # k248

qoc 20 mg225
series L7

does that help?

[rukkus11]

How long of cord are you using right now?

Jim

[JasonG31]

I believe its a 50ft orange one... But the length from outlet to shed is only 25ft or so

[french277V]

50 foot orange cord the key issue is you have to look at the conductor size it will have it imprint I know it may be little hard to find it but it is there somewhere.

Most cords I know typically under 14 gauge so it is too light a cord to use

The key item you say heater that will kill it no question asked.

The only safe way you can do this is run in subpanel this is the safest route to get it done.

There is other word or marking on SqD box you will have to take the cover off and look on the side there is a label or count the total breakers you have in there one of us can able tell ya
Here what the example look like

QO3040M1200 or something simaiur to this.

Merci,Marc

[JasonG31]

Originally Posted by french277V

50 foot orange cord the key issue is you have to look at the conductor size it will have it imprint I know it may be little hard to find it but it is there somewhere.

Most cords I know typically under 14 gauge so it is too light a cord to use

The key item you say heater that will kill it no question asked.

The only safe way you can do this is run in subpanel this is the safest route to get it done.

There is other word or marking on SqD box you will have to take the cover off and look on the side there is a label or count the total breakers you have in there one of us can able tell ya
Here what the example look like

QO3040M1200 or something simaiur to this.

Merci,Marc

I believe the box's serial number is QOC20MG225

[JasonG31]

ok the serial number on the inside with the panel off is

q0 20-40mg200

[ray2047]

Originally Posted by JasonG31

ok the serial number on the inside with the panel off is

q0 20-40mg200

So it can use 20 full size breakers or a mixture of full and half size breakers up to 40. How many breakers do you have in the box.

[JasonG31]

Originally Posted by ray2047

So it can use 20 full size breakers or a mixture of full and half size breakers up to 40. How many breakers do you have in the box.

Do you mean standard and tandem breakers? Can I use tandem in this box?

[french277V]

Yes you can use the CTL twinner in the SqD QO series

So you can have 20 full size or total of 40 twinner space between the two.

And here what QO twinner look like



BTW there is two verison on market one is CTL limit and the other one is non CTL verison the CTL verison will have addtional cam below while the non CTL verison do not have addtional cam at all. You may only use the CTL version. The non-CTL is for replacement use only.

And yes both are avabile at the big box store but the cost will be double over the standard single pole breakers.

Merci,Marc

[JasonG31]

Originally Posted by french277V

Yes you can use the twinner in the SqD QO series

So you can have 20 full size or total of 40 twinner space between the two.

And here what QO twinner look like



BTW there is two verison on market one is CTL limit and the other one is non CTL verison the CTL verison will have addtional cam below while the non CTL verison do not have addtional cam at all.

And yes both are avabile at the big box store but the cost will be double over the standard single pole breakers.

Merci,Marc

Thank you so much for all the information.

So I guess to run my own circut to the shed I'll need to run the extra set of wires from the panel to the crawl space, out the side of the house into conduit, through the trench into the shed. Thats the basics right?

[french277V]

Jason .,

Oui { yes } pretty much that way and let me post up a link to one of our sticky one of our member make a wonderfull drawing about the subpanel so you can get the idea how it lay out once you get the idea just tell us how big you want then we can able tell you the correct conductor size etc .,

Voila! here the link.

Sub-Panel Installation guide line drawings


And read the four wire feeder that will expain very clear on it and by the way with subpanel I know most panel you will end up buying a ground bussbar that is only few Euros/Bucks

If you have any more question just holler one of us will help ya.

Merci,
Marc

[pcboss]

Just a warning, non-metallic cable commonly called Romex cannot be used outside. Do not waste your time or effort. It cannot be used outside, even if it is in conduit.

UF cable or a PVC conduit with THWN rated conductors would be fine.