Fireplaces, Heating Stoves, Flues and Chimneys - antique fireplace

I have an antique mantel with a cast iron frame that goes around the opening. I am looking for something that will fit in it. If anyone can help, or suggest, I'd love to hear from you.

Thanks!

Sounds like you have an old coal burning fire place. From my experience, there's not much you can do with them unless you want to spend alot of money.

Best thing I can advise you to do is to visit http://www.csia.org and find a Certified Chimney Sweep in your area to come out and give you a recommendation. Don't be surprised if they tell you over the phone there's nothing that they'd be willing to do.

I'm sorry Sweep, I don't think I made myself clear. :( I have only the mantel and the cast iron opening that came out of an old house that was demolished. The opening is only about 2'w x 2 1/2' tall. I remember the inside of the fireplace to be brick. But I thought, I might like to find someone that has a modern metal fireplace insert w/a damper, that would fit my opening. I would like to encorperate my mantel in a new house. I thought maybe someone might make one that would fit it.

I'm truely sorry for the mix up and would still appreciate any info from you, or anyone else out there. I'm clueless when it comes to this kinda stuff and my husband doesn't know much either.

Signed at your mercy, Dez

No problem. I understand exactly what your are talking about now. Unfortunately, the answer is "No". All manufactures of factory built fireplaces (metal) will void the warranty if any modifactions are done to their product. There are to many things that could happen that would be a fire hazard. Besides, to the best of my knowledge, all widths of factory built fireplaces are greater in length than their heights.

If you want to incorporate this into your home, you'll need to build a masonry fireplace.

I am assumeing you know a good deal about fireplaces. So how safe is a masonary fireplace and do you think they are worth the time and money? Give me your oppinion on this. If you had this beautiful piece that you got at an extremely good deal and it would go purfect in your house, what would you do? Make it work in your new home or sell it. I really like this mantel. It is absolutely beautiful, but I have to be realistic. I know what I like but I'm also practical. I have thought of useing it as strickly ornimental (fake fireplace) on the wall, but I'd much rather be able to use it (on special occasions not for heating).

I'd like to hear what you think!

Waiting your repley, Dez

As a Certified Chimney Sweep, yes I do know a great deal about fireplaces and chimneys. I'd say your best bet is to use it for ornamental purposes only. What you have is the metal frame that went around ab old coal burning frieplace which had a very shallow firebox. Most of my customers that have attempted to burn wood in these have had smoking problems and had to have the firebox rebuilt to make it larger, that in itself, cost quite a few $$$. If you're only wanting it for special occasions, I'd say it's not worth the money to build a masonry chimney for it. The most that I would do would build a fake firebox, put a grow light in the top of it a stick a fern or other plant in it.

Just a curiousity question here. There should be 4 metal tabs on the sides sticking inward. These were there to hold a metal cover to close of the fireplace when it wasn't being used in warmer months. Do you have this part also? If so, hold on to it, they are very difficult to find!

And to answer your question about how safe is a masonry fireplace, the answer is, "Anytime you build an open fire in a structure mainly built of wood, 'safe' is a relative term." I never tell my customers that their chimney is safe due to the fact I was not there when the chimney was built (many things can't be seen on the inside of the chimney) and the fact I have no control over their burning habits or how well seasoned the wood they are burning is.

With a well constructed chimney, good burning habits and frequent inspections and sweepings, a home owner can greatly decrease the chances of a chimney fire, but never completely eliminate the possibility. All it takes is a little creosote build up and someone throwing some paper in the fire, e.g., Christmas wrapping paper, and whooosh! You got a chimney fire!

For some really good informations about fireplaces and chimneys visit these web sites:

http://www.chimneys.com

http://www.csia.org

http://www.ncsg.org

Yes Sweep in answer to your question, I do have the cast iron cover that goes over the opening of the fireplace when it is not in use. It has a woman standing in a long flowing gown. I also have the origonal tile that goes around the opening.

So, since I haven't built my house yet and will be starting the fireplace from scratch does this mean that no matter what, I cannot make a deeper firebox? I don't understand what you mean by it being shallow? I also thought of putting a gas fake log insert in. Would there be a problem there as well? OR...my husband and brother came up with the idea of putting a gas heater in the opening, and when not in use set it back in the hole and cover it. We also liked the idea of putting a fern in the opening and my brother suggested haveing both gas and electric outlets. What do you think?

I still like the idea of a real fire in the fireplace though. :( I still visualize my children eating gooey toasted marshmellows, and my little fireplace beaming with joy because we enjoy it so much.

Looking forward to your reply, Dez :)

If you haven't built your house yet, building a fireplace and chimney for it shouldn't be a problem if you have the funds for a masonry. I'd recommend that the standards in NFPA-211 be followed exactly, NFPA=National Fire Protection Association.

What I mean by shallow, is that the original design of the firebox was maybe about 1 foot deep (from the opening to the back wall of the firebox). If you're going to burn wood in it, the firebox should be deeper (maybe 2 to 2.5 feet from the opening to the back wall of the firebox.

The best thing you can do if you decide to take this course is hire a Certified Chimney Sweep for advice and to supervise the construction of the fireplace and chimney.

What I mean by supervise is, have him stop by from time to time to ensure the chimney is being constructed properly.
Some of the things I find during major repairs are that the flue tiles inside the chimney don't have 1/2 inch to 4 inches clearance from the chimney walls but are either cemented into the structure of the chimney or there is a large void in the chimney between the walls and the flue tiles. I also find improper crown (top) construction and base assembly (foundation) construction.

I know the above might not make much sense to you, but it will to the Chimney Sweep and he/she can make sure the masons build it correctly. Visit the http://www.csia.org site to find one in your area.

As far as fake gas logs, I'm assuming you are refering to a fake electric set and not the so called "vent free" gas logs. I wouldn't see a problem with the fake electric logs but you will have problems finding the vent free style that will fit. The heater idea sounds okay also, but be sure you have proper clearance from combustibles which you'll have to go by depending on what type of heater you use.

To answer your question about having gas and an electrical outlet in the fire box I would say NO. However, you need to check with the gas company and your local building codes. Professional speaking though, it doesn't sound like a good idea.

...and finally, and I know you don't want to hear this, I wouldn't let any kids toast any marshmellows in the fireplace. One wrong move and you've got a goey mess stuck to the sides of your fire box that isn't fun getting off. Worse yet, if for some reason a goey marshmellow gets bumped up agains the damper, catches fire and you have some good creosote build up, you could have a chimney fire and more than likely be looking at some expensive repairs at least---burn your house down and loss of life in a worst case scenerio. I know its hard to believe that such an enjoyable event could cause such a catastrophy but you would be surprised. Leave the marshmellow toasting to outside camp fires.

Also, for some reason, even though you may surpervise your kids with the fireplace and tell them never to mess with it while your not watching, at some point they'll think they don't need you around to add a little wood, or maybe some newspaper plastic armey men, tennis balls, magazines, sisters stuffed animal, brothes Hot Wheels, trash---I've just about seen it all.

Best wishes,
Sweep

Sweep thanks so much for all that information. I did not think about the possible problems of catching the house on fire with a single marshmellow. And no I don't understand all that mumbo gumbo about fireplace terms :) I will however look into finding a chimmey sweep in my area and a good mason. If it does't work out that I can afford this route, I'll check with the electric company and go from there :)

Agian Sweep, thanks so much for your time. You have been such a great help and I really do appreciate it.

Take care :), Desiree

More than welcome. Any other questions, just post them here. I've got an e-mail alert when there is a knew post here and I normally check this thread every few days or so.

Sweeps Luck!

Sweep,

Ironically, my wife and I just looked at a 200 year old home yesterday with a coal burning fireplace like you described. A couple of questions:

When you say $$$ to deepen the firplace, how much is $$$?
Do they make wood burning stoves that would fit nicely? How costly might that be?

Thanks in advance.

TomC,

I can't give you an exact price due to prices fluctuate greatly throughout the country. I can tell you that the last one I enlarged was $800 which included a damper being installed.

With a 200 year old chimney, I'd have the exterior closely inspected for soundness. Also, if it hasn't already had a lner installed, you'll need to do this also. Price? Anywhere from $2,500 to $4,000 depending on what size liner, height, and labor involved getting the thing in.

As far as installing a wood stove, the answer is "no". Their are very limited choices for stove inserts, and even the hearth stove will give you a problem. A hearth stove sits out in front of the fire box on the hearth. I personally had to look for 2 years before I found a hearth stove that I could use with my old coal burning fireplace due to the height of the flue collar on most stoves being higher than the top of the firebox.

Here also, either with an insert (firebox would still have to be enlarged---that is if you can find one small enough to slide into the firebox) or with a hearth stove, you will still need to install a liner from the flue collar of the stove to the top of the chimney with UL Listed foil faced insulation of 1 inch thickness. You'll probably end up spending just as much, if not more for the stove and the installation of it.

For some good information that you can review go to:

http://www.chimneys.com

http://www.csia.org

http://www.ncsg.org