Lighting, Light Fixtures, Ceiling and Exhaust Fans - Wiring Question

I just wired two 3 way switchs for our porch light. The first one is in the house by the front door and the second one is on the porch by the porch door. Now I would like to add a standard switch next to the second 3 way switch by the porch door to run an outside light. Can I wire the standard switch to the 3 way switch and how would I wire it.

Kenny

Probably not.

There are many different ways to wire a pair of 3-way switches, and we don't have any details on what you did, but if you just ran power to S1 to S2 to light, then you cannot run anything from S2.

Where is the power source wire located for the 3-way switches?

Probably not.

There are many different ways to wire a pair of 3-way switches, and we don't have any details on what you did, but if you just ran power to S1 to S2 to light, then you cannot run anything from S2.

Ok here's what I have...
Front door
Double gang box (B1)
Standard switch (S1)
3 way switch (S2)

Porch door
Double gang box (B2)
3 way switch (S3)
Standard switch (S4)

12-2 fuse panel wire (12-2FP)
12-2 living room fan/light wire (12-2LR)
12-3 wire between B1 and B2 (12-3B1) (12-3B2)
12-2 porch fan/light wire (12-2P)
12-2 outside light (12-2OL)

12-2FP black wire hooked to common terminal of S2.
Black jumper wire hooked to top terminal of S1 to hole in back of S2 by common terminal.
12-2LR black wire to hole in back of S1 by bottom terminal.
12-3B1 black wire hooked to bottom left terminal of S2 to same terminal on S3.
12-3B1 red wire hooked to bottom right terminal of S2 to same terminal on S3.
12-2FP, 12-2LR and 12-3B1 white wires wire nutted together in B1.
12-3B2 and 12-2P black wire to common terminal of S3.
Black jumper wire hooked to top terminal of S4 to hole in back of S3 by common terminal.
12-2OL black wire to hole in back of S4 by bottom terminal.
12-3B2, 12-2P and 12-2OL white wires wire nutted together in B2.

This all works except that the porch fan/light needs to be on for the outside light to work. This is what I do not understand. I have S3 & S4 wired the same way as S1 & S2 and the living room fan/light and porch fan/light work independently from each other. Shouldn’t the porch fan/light and outside light work the same way??????

Well, it works exactly as you wired it to work. But you don't have enough wires to make it work the way you want it to work, no matter how you connect it.

The problem is that you have no unswitched hot wire in box B2. And switch S4 needs such a wire.

There are quite a number of different ways to fix this. Probably the simplest is to run a 12/2 cable between B1 and B2. That will allow you to bring an unswitched hot into B2 so that you can use it for S4.

I have S3 & S4 wired the same way as S1 & S2 and the living room fan/light and porch fan/light work independently from each other.As you now know, that's not good enough. Right now, the input hot wire into S1 is an unswitched hot, but the input hot wire into S4 is a switched hot. That's why they work differently.

Thanks for the help John. Looks like a trip to Home Depot for some more 12-2 wire.

Hey John I've decided that instead of running another 12-2 wire to the switch in B2 I want to install a sub panel on the porch and wire the porch and shed from it. Off the panel I will be installing 4 indoor outlets, 2 outdoor outlets and 2 switches for front and back door lights. I will also be running wire from the sub panel to the shed for an inside light and 2 outlets. I'm pretty sure I can wire everything from the panel but I'm not sure about what type of panel, circuit breakers and wire I will need to install the sub panel. Here are a couple of other things you might need to know. The sub panel will be at least 20 to 25 feet from the main panel and the wire between the panels will have to be run under our mobile home. Can you give me an idea on what I will need to buy for this project?

First, a caveat. Adding a subpanel is a fairly advanced electrical project. There are a hundred things you need to know. Based on your current project, you might want to realistically evaluate whether or not you have the required skills.

Having said that, almost any small subpanel you find at your home center will do.

I cannot provide many more details because there are lots of things about your situation that I don't know. First, I assume that this "porch" would be considered part of the same structure as the one containing your main panel. Is that true? Next, you should know that you can only run one circuit or one feeder to the shed. Not more.

One very key decision you need to make is how many kilowatts you need to power from this subpanel. That requires a careful evaluation of everything that will be powered from the subpanel and the usage pattern of that stuff. Once you come up with a kilowatt number, that will guide most of the other decisions.

First, a caveat. Adding a subpanel is a fairly advanced electrical project. There are a hundred things you need to know. Based on your current project, you might want to realistically evaluate whether or not you have the required skills.

Having said that, almost any small subpanel you find at your home center will do.

I cannot provide many more details because there are lots of things about your situation that I don't know. First, I assume that this "porch" would be considered part of the same structure as the one containing your main panel. Is that true? Next, you should know that you can only run one circuit or one feeder to the shed. Not more.

One very key decision you need to make is how many kilowatts you need to power from this subpanel. That requires a careful evaluation of everything that will be powered from the subpanel and the usage pattern of that stuff. Once you come up with a kilowatt number, that will guide most of the other decisions.

Yes you are right it’s actually an addition not a "porch". We had a 10x20 deck on the front of our mobile home that was falling apart so we decided to tear it down and build the 10x20 addition for some extra living space. I guess that would also answer the usage question as well. I found this "how to" article earlier this afternoon and I think it will be of big help to me.
Adding New Electrical Circuits - Installing A Sub-Panel - An Overview (http://www.hammerzone.com/archives/elect/panel/sub_panel/01/overview.htm)
On the plus side the main panel in the article is the same as ours. So I imagine that I could use the same setup as they did. I have also done a ruff electrical layout in PowerPoint of my plans for the addition. It doesn’t show the front and back outside lights, the inside fan/light or the shed layout. But you get the idea.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v421/kredfearn/Presentation1-1.jpg
Now why can I only run one circuit to the shed?? I would like to run two wires. One 12/3 wire from the 3 way switch in the addition to a 3 way switch inside the shed. Like this...12/2 from the sub panel to the first 3 way then the 12/3 to the second 3 way inside the shed and then to the inside shed light. The second wire would be 12/2 from the sub panel to the two outlets in the shed. HEY you know what I just thought of something. Will I need any permits or have the electrical work inspected?? I have done some electrical work of this scale before for my mother but where she lives there was no need for any permits or inspections. Check it out and let me know what you think about the article and my layout. TRUST me I'm doing as much research as I can before I even attempt this project. You are and will be a big help to me as well.