Toilets, Sinks, Showers, Tubs and Disposals - How to change a diverter

About a month ago I found that water was coming from the upstairs bathroom into the furnace room in the basement. I had thought that it was the pipes for the tub. Recently while the shower was on, I was downstairs and noticed quiet a bit of water coming from the upstairs bathroom. I checked the bathroom and eventually found that water was dripping down at a fast rate behind the tub. I also found that when the tap runs, there is no drip. The drip starts immediately after I pull the handle for the shower. The diverter is located on the tub spout and the handle reads that it is a moen.

I have a whirlpool tub in a very small bathroom. The tub/shower is tiled and around the faucet and handle, the tiles are starting to come off. I have tried to get right in the frame for the tub but because my bathroom is so small, my tub is maybe 8inches from the toilet, I can not get in there to see exactly where it is dripping. I had asked a plumber what might be the problem and he thought if it wasn't the copper piping going upto my shower spout it could be the diverter.

I thought if it was the diverter could it splash water in behind the wall without having any loss in water pressure?

I have changed a shower diverter before as it was classified as a 2 or 3 handle. I have never ever changed a diverter on the front of the spout. I don't want to pay the plumber if it is something I can do myself. Any ideas where I can get a how to video/directions/instruction/step by step on how to change this? Unless someone thinks it is something else.

Good Morning:gmorning:

If I am correct, most Moen faucets use a slip on spout. I am sure there may be a few older spouts that still screw onto the pipe.

But, if its a slip spout as I suspect, you will want to look on the bottom of the spout near the tub/shower wall. There is a drain hole there, most spouts have one, and inside that hole there will be an allen/hex screw. You will need to loosen that screw and then just pull the spout off.

If you run the shower and look at the weep hole, if the problem were coming from the spout, you should see water coming from there.

Question?
Does the leak occur when the shower is running and nobody is in the shower?
Did you not say that there are tiles coming loose or off around the tub valve?

One thing you can do is take some water from another source and while someone is in the basement, starting at the lowest item, pour water onto each item, ( pop up lever, tub spout, shower valve.) one at a time, and see if you get a leak. Sometimes it is just something needs to be caulked, or tiles repaired, and when someone is showering, the water splashes off their body onto the wall and leaks out.
Just another possibility.

It is a Delta (monitor) not Moen as I thought. My tap in the kitchen is a moen.

I originally tried running the water through the faucet/spout. No water drip. The leak does occur when the shower is on and noone is in. I too thought maybe it was leaking from my tiles until I just ran the shower and didn't spray anything on the tiles. Also I notice that there is a slight drip coming from the tub spout when the shower is on (if that helps).

I just never heard of a shower diverter that would cause a back spray where the pipes are which could be causing the damage to my tiles. I was told that if the tiles are loosening then water has damaged the drywall causing the adhesive for the tiles to loosen.

I am hoping that it isn't the actual copper pipe to my shower as that would mean alot of work to get at.

My house was built in 1962 so there is really no way to access the pipe without cutting a hole where the tiles are or in my kitchen wall. I do know that there appeared that there was water damage before(when we first moved into the house) on the floor/subfloor when you are downstairs looking up. I however thought it was due to the toilet leaking.

I do know that a previous owner had moved the wall for the kitchen/bathroom back about a foot into the bathroom. I hope that when they did this that they didn't damage the pipe when laying the drywall. Although I would think that they would of seen or noticed the damage right away.

Anyway does this sound like it could be the diverter?

I highly doubt the diverter spout is the problem, Even though I have been wrong once before.:)

Delta tub spouts just screw off, but you need a delta spout to replace it with.

I think this something to do with the shower head, or the line going to it is the culprit. Has anyone changed the shower head or added one of those shower caddy's lately?
All the tub spout/ diverter does is stops the water from going out the spout, forcing it up through the shower head.

Shower head arms get brittle over time and break off. This is typical. If you cannot physically see any leaks, you may need to open the wall.

Have you tried looking up from the basement into the cavity behind the shower where the drain comes through, with a flashlight? Look for the highest point you see water coming from. If it looks like it is coming from above the valve, I would check the shower head are next.

I have change the showerhead a couple of months ago but I don't understand how that could cause the leak. There is no way that I can look up from downstairs and see where the leak is. I have taken pictures in attemp to attach them to this post but I guess I'm not allowed to post pics here. Sorry, it makes it hard to explain without a picture. The floor covers the whole area. The only thing exposed is where the drain pipe is because the ceiling in my furnance room is not done..

Open a free account with a site like photobucket.com and upload your pictures there. Then post the link on this site. Thats how most members do it. Some get pictures on this site, and I don't know how they do it.

If you tightened too much or pulled on the chrome pipe going into the wall, you may have cracked the threads on that pipe so every time you use the shower it leaks. I am willing to bet that is your problem, especially after you said you have changed your shower head recently.

Ok...hope that I have uploaded these pictures right.


http://i527.photobucket.com/albums/cc353/sarahbear74/IMG_1655.jpg

Damage to the tiles. Tiles are coming are coming off. Not sure if it's due to water damage or poor installation. This is the only place that the tiles are coming off.


http://i527.photobucket.com/albums/cc353/sarahbear74/IMG_1656.jpg

Showerhead I changed a few months back or more?


http://i527.photobucket.com/albums/cc353/sarahbear74/IMG_1658.jpg

Where the water is dripping from. That pipe is coming from my tub.

http://i527.photobucket.com/albums/cc353/sarahbear74/IMG_1659.jpg

Another picture of the tub pipe.


http://i527.photobucket.com/albums/cc353/sarahbear74/IMG_1660.jpg

This is the pipe for my toilet. I originally thought that this was the cause of my drip. You can see the damage that is on the floor already which was there prior to us moving in. I am in the furnace room looking up.

OK, first off, the cover plate for the overflow in the tub is upside down and needs to be turned over.

See the rectangle hole in picture 1658 with the tub drain coming down through it? Is there any way with a flashlight that you can look up there and see what is happening? You need to find the problem if possible before ripping out walls.

I wish I could get underneath and look but.....there is a heating duct/vent directly below that pipe and is atleast 2- 3 feet in width so I can't even cut the floor back a bit to look:wall: Who ever planned the piping and bathroom didn't think it through very well as I have already had a plumber come in and correct piping for my kitchen sink/washer and garborator!!

I was just hoping that it would be something as simple as the diverter...I'd rather spend $20 or so on a diverter than rip a hole in my wall!!

If you have any other suggestions, I would greatly appreciate them otherwise thanks for everything so far!!

Nobody ever thinks about how they are going to repair things 20 years later.

From the info given, The only thing I can recommend would be to open the wall behind the faucet. If there are cabinets, use the lower cabinet to make a hole and try to figure out where the leak is and you can just put a piece of 1/4" plywood over that hole. If you find the problem to be higher than that, as I suspect you will, You will need to open the wall up further. Hopefully it is only sheet rock. (easy fix:rolleyes:)

My middle name is 'repairs'.

I took one look at the first photo and instantly came back with my answer:

Likely when they tiled, the existing nipple going to the tub spout wound up a hair short, and they screwed on the spout till it bottomed out on the tile, as one would do. BUT, the spout really was not as tight as it should have been, - but they could not turn it on any more, because it was prematurely bottoming out on the tiles!

So even with pipe dope, over time, the water pressure has eaten away at the nipple threads. And now, when you divert, you cause additional backpresure in that nipple, which forces more water out the bad/somewhat loose or rotting nipple threads in the spout. Your problem is not your divertor, I guarantee. It is the nipple going into the back of the spout itself is where the spout leaks (if it is the spout area at all)

About 3 weeks ago I had to remove a tub spout for the same reason!, and found orangy rotting tub spout nipple threads with orange water streaks running back into the wall, - and the backspray in the wall wicked in the sheetrock and I had to section out about 1 foot up from the tub and then redid that area with another material and it really does not look cobbled. It looks like someone intended for it to look that way as a guard around the mixers and spout. I used glassboard over 1/2" plywood (instead of sheetrock). Looks nice.

IF your problem is not water running in the upside down overflow plate (and even at that you'd still have to have a bad or loose rubber gasket behind it). Then I suspect you simply need to unscrew your spout and probably get a new nipple and possibly custom cut so you do not bottom out on the tiles before fully tight (this planning can be difficult, to get the length just right), or, you get the kind of spout that even if you have too much nipple sticking out the wall, you are provided with a long plastic fitting that first screws on the nipple,. Then the spout, which contains a sealing o'ring inside screws onto that plastic piece. You silicone or plumber's grease that o-ring. Use teflon tape and teflon dope on the nipple, together, when you screw it into the mixer valve's elbow, and it will not leak.

In your first photo--showing shower handle--is your water
supply shut off coming to shower fixture?
I just wondered as it is set to HOT.

I have a Delta monitor shower fixture--when off handle points to 3 O'clock--move to left to turn on--at full hot handle will not go past 11 O'clock--has someone been playing with this
fixture ???

If you find leak is at cartridge--it has a lifetime warranty--call Delta & give them code #
on side of cartridge--they will send you a $40 unit for free--also tell them what color the
cartridge is........................................