Heat Pumps and Electric Heating - Not enough heat...single or dual stage?

All,

Not getting comfortable heat from my heat pump unit. The house is 5 years old, and it has a weather king indoor and outdoor units with the following model numbers:

Outdoor: 10PJA3701

Indoor: 17AHJ14S02C01

Some wise guy tore off the energy ratings sticker from the unit. Is this is single or dual stage unit? Also, would this be a 10 SEER unit given the model number of the outdoor unit above? I went on Rheem/RUUD site and the lowest models they show are 13PJA. Unit MFR date is 5/2002.

If this is a really low efficiency unit, I may think about just having it replaced. Anyone have any suggestions? I have already cleaned the air filter and return vents.

I maybe should also note that I tried switching on emergency heat for about 30 minutes and the air coming from the vents was cold...and the air coming from the vents with it on regular heat mode is only luke warm. The temps outside right now are around 30F, but we fully expect temps down in the 20s at night all week.

I recently replaced the thermostat, but the heat wasn't great before that. The old one was a honeywell T8411R and I replaced that with a RTH7000 5-1-1 programmable unit. I am just confused as I just bought the house on 11/21. It does manage to get up to temps...but it takes a really really long time to do so. We set it on 62F during the day and at night while we are in bed...the rest of the time it is on 70F.

Home is about 2200 sq ft with the finished basement. I know the builder probably cheaped out on the unit, and all we have is electric around here.

Any and all advice welcome. Thanks in advance.

Ken

Outdoor: 10PJA3701

Indoor: 17AHJ14S02C01
10 SEERS single stage system.


I maybe should also note that I tried switching on emergency heat for about 30 minutes and the air coming from the vents was cold...
You should have heat.... Electric heat for back up.. You know if your air handler has electric heat banks in it? Look for a large power line going into it, or breakers on it.



I recently replaced the thermostat, but the heat wasn't great before that. The old one was a honeywell T8411R and I replaced that with a RTH7000 5-1-1 programmable unit.
Why did you replace it? Just because it wasn't heating right?


I am just confused as I just bought the house on 11/21.
so, we don't know well it did in the summer..

It does manage to get up to temps...but it takes a really really long time to do so. We set it on 62F during the day and at night while we are in bed...the rest of the time it is on 70F.

Heat pump is not a fast recovery system. Since you don't have electric heat back up, it will take a very long time.. If you did have electric heat strip, the t-stat will use that to help get up to temp, however, it's going to kill you on the electric bill..

So, my advise, SET IT AND FORGET IT.

Hi Jay,

Thanks for responding. No, I don't know how well it did in the summer. My wife's uncle and his wife lived here....but they moved out in March of 07, the house was actually owned by his wife's parents...and it took us 6 months to get them to accept our offer since they thought they could get 100k more for the house then we were offering.

It has two breakers right on the front of the air handler and I took the covers off to clean dust out and it looks like a lot of electrical wiring in there and every home around here that has electric heat always has the emergency heat installed which is guess is in the form of strips.

You have to pardon my ignorance when it comes to these things as I really don't have too much knowledge of heat pumps or whatnot.

I replaced the thermostat simply for the ability to program the new one to save on energy costs. I even went as far as to convert all the light bulbs in the home to the energy efficient bulbs. I remember a couple of years ago when I had my system replaced at my townhouse....which originally had an 8 SEER system from the mid 80's installed...that was replaced with a 14 SEER Carrier unit with variable speed fan and it chopped about $45 per month off my electric bill in the winter months.

I was afraid this was a 10 SEER unit....which IIRC is the lowest efficiency unit available today. I may just have someone come out and give me an estimate on upgrading the system. By the way the system is laid out, this should be a 1, 2, 3 replacement. I would like to get at least a 14 or 15 SEER unit to keep it comfortable in here. I have a small child and a complaining wife on my hands so I have to do something.

The new thermostat only has two settings for programming it. It says either multi-stage heat pump (with emergency backup) or single stage heat pump with no emergency backup. It does seem to be heating, so I don't think it is a problem with the TSTAT.

It has two breakers right on the front of the air handler and I took the covers off to clean dust out and it looks like a lot of electrical wiring in there and every home around here that has electric heat always has the emergency heat installed which is guess is in the form of strips.
Make sure the breakers are turned on, and also, take a look at your main breaker panel. If all is on, then look for the t-stat wire, and find out what letters is hooked up to the t-stat wire from above.. The electric heat should come on when you turn on Emrg Heat at the t-stat.



I replaced the thermostat simply for the ability to program the new one to save on energy costs. I even went as far as to convert all the light bulbs in the home to the energy efficient bulbs.
Glad to see you are out to help to save on energy, but as I said before, Heat pump are best to set it and forget it.. They just don't have the recovery like you would have on a gas furnace, and also if your back up electric heat did work, it going to cost more to run when you do back up since it takes the electric to catch up.

I may just have someone come out and give me an estimate on upgrading the system.
IF this over your head, may be get someone to see for you why you are not getting the full heat.. The system may be low on charge.. If you do get a bid, get 3 bids, and be sure the dealer does a Manual J on YOUR home..

The new thermostat only has two settings for programming it. It says either multi-stage heat pump (with emergency backup) or single stage heat pump with no emergency backup.
You want Multi stage with back up.. What letters did you hook up to the t-stat?

With any and all of the heatpumps we tell people to set the tstat and let it alone. Like said they dont have the pick up that other gas or oil units have. When you set it back and the temp in the home goes down.When you push it back up then the electric elements kick in to help. So it cost you what you saved.
You can go over to EME or AUX on the tstat just to see what heat you do get from the unit.
Yes we have units that go up to a seer of 15 also have them that go on up to a 19 seer. If you will stay in the home for 10 years or more go for the good stuff. A V/S blower and the seer of 15 or more. You also want to look at the HSPF of the unit. Thats for the heat pump like a AC seer of 15 and a HSPF of 8.05 on a unit is good.
It helps to make sure your filter is clean like every 30 to 90 days a new one not over a MERV 5. You say you cleaned it . But is the coil clean???Might check it also . For sure get 3 bids for any new job on the home.;)

With any and all of the heatpumps we tell people to set the tstat and let it alone. Like said they dont have the pick up that other gas or oil units have. When you set it back and the temp in the home goes down.When you push it back up then the electric elements kick in to help. So it cost you what you saved.
You can go over to EME or AUX on the tstat just to see what heat you do get from the unit.
Yes we have units that go up to a seer of 15 also have them that go on up to a 19 seer. If you will stay in the home for 10 years or more go for the good stuff. A V/S blower and the seer of 15 or more. You also want to look at the HSPF of the unit. Thats for the heat pump like a AC seer of 15 and a HSPF of 8.05 on a unit is good.
It helps to make sure your filter is clean like every 30 to 90 days a new one not over a MERV 5. You say you cleaned it . But is the coil clean???Might check it also . For sure get 3 bids for any new job on the home.;)

Your comment on filters is interesting. I am having problems with my HP unit, ( see seperate thread). I am hearing different opinion on filters. Someone told me that I am using too goo of a filter and that could be reducing the units efficiancy as they are restricting the return air flow. After hearing this I recall when the unit was running attempting to pull out the filter and there was such a vacuum that I had difficulty removing it. They told me to use the cheapo blue ones and just change them often. Do you and everyone else agree?

First, thank you all for your replies. This forum rocks!

I would like to get a 19 SEER becuase I am a green kind of guy I guess. I always try to conserve energy whereever I can. But the only question is will I be able to afford the price diff between a 15 SEER and a 19 SEER.

Now that I think about what you are saying, it makes total sense that it is better to set it and forget it, unlike the A/C the heat pump has to work really really hard to heat the home....I mean it literally takes about 1.5 house to get it from 62 to 70 when the morning cycle changes over. I connected the wires properly on the new TSTAT to the same places they were on the old one and according to the installation manual.

I am gonna get a couple of estimates, but I have another question:

I really like the Lennox XP19, but have no clue what it is going to cost. Does anyone have any ideas of a price range I would be looking at, or if there are better units out there? It is really a simple install....due to basement and right on the other side of the wall is the unit outside...the most they would have to do in addition to install the AH and HP is to run new refridge lines, but that is a very short run. I am thinking they are probably going to say around $5,000 but I would obviously like that price to be a lot less :)

Your Low!!!!!!!

Your Low!!!!!!!


I am assuming you mean on the $5,000 price I quoted below. Does anyone have ballpark figure of what I would be looking at?