Doors and Windows - Argon vs Krypton gas in replacement windows
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bigdaddrock
05-22-07, 06:12 PM
Am buying replacement windows for front of house. All others in house are now double pane. I am now looking at triple panes for front windows. Should I go the extra 10% for Krypton vs Argon gas? Or am I tossing good money away for little or no extra return?
XSleeper
05-22-07, 08:27 PM
I'm not quite sure what you are asking. If gas fill is used in a triple pane unit, it will always be Krypton. If gas fill is used in double pane units, it is almost always Argon.
One is not necessarily better than the other, it is simply a matter of physics. Argon performs best inside a dead air space that is roughly 1/2" wide, whereas Krypton performs better than Argon in smaller spaces- roughly 1/4" wide or so.
The gas fill will obviously increase the u-factor of the windows. It's hard to say whether it is worth it. Kind of like asking if heated seats are worth it in a new car. Probably depends how long you will be in the house.
Triple pane/Krypton units are quite superior to Double pane/Argon ones. You didn't mention Low-E, but hopefully that's included in the mix as well.
To help you rationalize whether it is worth the extra money for the better glass package, consider this illustration (example): You have 4 walls of a home. 3 of the walls are filled with R-13 insulation, while the 4th wall is filled with R-19 insulation. The 4th wall certainly will feel warmer than the others and will be more energy efficient. R-19 costs more than R-13. Is it worth it? You'd have to run the numbers if you want to know how many years it will take for payback. The same might be said for your windows. But it's hard to calculate because when it comes to windows, so many other factors are involved. Unless your old windows were*very* drafty or were single pane, new efficient windows actually will take a very long time to pay for themselves.
One is not necessarily better than the other, it is simply a matter of physics. Argon performs best inside a dead air space that is roughly 1/2" wide, whereas Krypton performs better than Argon in smaller spaces- roughly 1/4" wide or so.
The gas fill will obviously increase the u-factor of the windows. It's hard to say whether it is worth it. Kind of like asking if heated seats are worth it in a new car. Probably depends how long you will be in the house.
Triple pane/Krypton units are quite superior to Double pane/Argon ones. You didn't mention Low-E, but hopefully that's included in the mix as well.
To help you rationalize whether it is worth the extra money for the better glass package, consider this illustration (example): You have 4 walls of a home. 3 of the walls are filled with R-13 insulation, while the 4th wall is filled with R-19 insulation. The 4th wall certainly will feel warmer than the others and will be more energy efficient. R-19 costs more than R-13. Is it worth it? You'd have to run the numbers if you want to know how many years it will take for payback. The same might be said for your windows. But it's hard to calculate because when it comes to windows, so many other factors are involved. Unless your old windows were*very* drafty or were single pane, new efficient windows actually will take a very long time to pay for themselves.
Just Bill
05-23-07, 05:37 AM
Sleeper pretty well covered it, but to add, gas filled(regardless of which) makes the windows more energy efficient at only a small price increase, definitely worth it with todays energy costs. Double pane vs tripple pane is different, likely a big cost difference and hard to justify. If you were to stay in the house for a long time, I might consider it.
Oberon
05-26-07, 07:44 AM
What they said ^...
To follow-up Just Bill, energy costs are going to be going thru the roof - there is no end in sight.
And to follow up X-Sleeper a bit - the advantage of the triple pane is the LowE coating. Triple pane allows the manufacturer to coat two different lites - generally surfaces 2 and 5 - and that is where the real advantage of the triple pane lies.
Again to follow up on X-Sleeper's comments - and as a general guideline - some triple pane windows are made with wide (~7/16" or so) air-space between the lites. In that case go with argon because the krypton upgrade would not be worth the extra cost.
But, if the windows that you are looking at have ~1/4 airspace then by-all-means go with the krypton because then the upgrade is probably worth the extra money.
My daughter is currently building a home. The windows that I spec'd for her home are triple pane with dual LowE coating, wider airspace, and argon fill. The fixed units have a rating of U -.16 and the operators have a rating of U -.21. Again, with argon and wider airspace. These were not frighteningly expensive windows.
It is possible with current technology to get down to about a U -.1 with narrow airspace and krypton fill - but it can get very expensive to do so.
To follow-up Just Bill, energy costs are going to be going thru the roof - there is no end in sight.
And to follow up X-Sleeper a bit - the advantage of the triple pane is the LowE coating. Triple pane allows the manufacturer to coat two different lites - generally surfaces 2 and 5 - and that is where the real advantage of the triple pane lies.
Again to follow up on X-Sleeper's comments - and as a general guideline - some triple pane windows are made with wide (~7/16" or so) air-space between the lites. In that case go with argon because the krypton upgrade would not be worth the extra cost.
But, if the windows that you are looking at have ~1/4 airspace then by-all-means go with the krypton because then the upgrade is probably worth the extra money.
My daughter is currently building a home. The windows that I spec'd for her home are triple pane with dual LowE coating, wider airspace, and argon fill. The fixed units have a rating of U -.16 and the operators have a rating of U -.21. Again, with argon and wider airspace. These were not frighteningly expensive windows.
It is possible with current technology to get down to about a U -.1 with narrow airspace and krypton fill - but it can get very expensive to do so.