Homeowners Associations - Homeowner's Association

I was just reading a thread about someone that lives in a community with a homeowner's association. Having lived in a very large city most of my life, I can't imagine why anyone would want to live in a place that dictates what you're allowed and not allowed to do and to have, what colors you're allowed to paint, what color your curtain lining's have to be, etc., etc.
If I buy a house, I want to do what I darn well want to do :D
Why do people want to move into places like this, anyway?

I have no idea why someone would wnat to live there. But there are some people that must be goverened by rules or they are not happy. I have built probably 1000 homes in Home Owner Assn Sub Divisions. I still do not understand it. It is just one of those things I guess. Not my problem.

Guess it's one of life's mysteries, LOL!

I live in a neighborhood with a HOA, of which I'm the treasurer.. We don't dictate what color to paint the house or curtains, but we do deny fences and large out-buildings.. Our dues are used to pay for the road upkeep, beaches, and insurance.. Not all HOAs are dictatorial..

Ask the guy who wants to put up a fence and a shed whether he thinks you're dictatorial.

I was shocked when my folks moved into a neighborhood like that
It wasn't total control, but they are such independent spirits

Then I also found out it keeps the neighbor's lawn also treated for ants, the neighbor's son from parking an RV in his folk's driveway and living in it with his grunge band, the neighborhood from being over-run with signs for tag sales that ended two years ago, the house next door from being rented weekly by vacationers who leave garbage on my folks lawn and "borrow" their boat...

I didn't get it at first at all
Then it became clear that a lot of the problems they had in other neighborhoods went away
For them, a small price to pay

Some HOA's wield almost dictatorial power and others do almost nothing. Sickshift has pointed out some reasons why people like to live in communities with HOA's.

Myself, I'd rather not have a neighbor, or group of neighbors, dictating what I may or may not do so I choose to live in an area that does not have a HOA.

Having painted in various subdivisions with HOAs I know there can be big differences between them. Some do require HOA approval prior to changing paint colors - who wants to live next to the flouresent pepto bismal pink house :eek: Mainly they just want to keep the neighborhood nice.

........but I'm like furd, I need my elbow room. That's why I live on top of 15+ acres. Basically I can do what I want and not disturb the neighbors and whatever they do doesn't bother me :D

Slickshift explained it very well.

A good HOA just defines and enforces community standards, so you don't have to have those little chats with neighbors who use leaf blowers at 7:00 a.m. on Sunday mornings.

If the rules are very detailed, they seem stricter, but actually detailed rules are better than vague ones that the cranky neighbors [and there are always cranky neighbors] can use to torture you incessently. 'Lawn no higher than 6" ' is BETTER than 'well-maintained lawn'.

I even like the idea of dictating house colors now, as long as people can paint shutters and doors any ridiculous fluorescent color they chose.

"If I buy a house, I want to do what I darn well want to do Why do people want to move into places like this, anyway?"

Agreed home owner associations is like socialism!

"Why do people want to move into places like this, anyway?"


So they don't have to worry about the neighbors trashing up their yard/home and affecting the value of the neighborhood. They serve an usefull purpose.

I wouldn't want to live in one either :D mainly because I wouldn't live in a neighborhood - I desire the elbow room I have living in a rural area.

Along with the others, I don't understand the HOA either, but then, I don't understand wanting to live elbow to elbow. If I stand at my window, and you stand at your window, and we can carry on a conversation without raising our voice, you live too damn close. All the houses in those subs seem to be the same. You might as well live an apartment complex.

I'm on 2 acres and my neighbors are still closer than I'd like.

I understand the reasoning behind them, and sometimes they can be useful (neighbor is selling house, abandons house, and parks extra cars leaking oil in front of YOUR house). But we had to fight tooth and nail with one that wanted us to move a radon mitigation system pipe to the back of the house because it could be seen from the road otherwise, and it took an act of the heavens to let us paint the unsightly pipe instead. Oh and they got mad at us for putting down landscaping gravel in our garden, which we did because the high winds kept blowing away the landscaping bark. But when we wanted to paint the fence they could not give us guidelines....

We live in a non-HOAed house now :-)

Hmm, I guess they've got their good and bad points. Lucky you all that live in a single, settled in acres of ground. Maybe some day but right now I live elbow to elbow, but we've got pretty good neighbors, no crazy colors except for one time one neighbor decided to paint his steps a bright orange, :eek: but his wife made him go out and rent a power washer immediately, LOL!
I"ll tell you, every time I see one of these developments, I think of "Stepford Wives". No, thank you, I'll take some kooky neighbors anyday :D

It must be our North American free spirit that makes people hate to be told what they can do with their property.

My Aunt was looking at buying a condo. She was so indignant when they told her she couldn't build a fence or have a big dog. I asked her if thats how he felt, why consider a condo? Thats how it works.

Speaking of elbow room, we live on one of the biggest lots in our area. I have never even seen some of my neighbors because of the trees and distance. We're on a court with only 7 houses and have lived here for 22 years. Now we are having a house built in an elbow area. My wife thinks its great but I'm dreading it.

I went through many years of single family homes and building a second residence. I have had my fill and chose to buy into a 25 year old unit. We wanted to buy a unit with an aged interior that could be remodeled. I rented for a year while I decided what I wanted.

With a good association, you give up some independance on the exterior decor, but get the guarantee there will not be an eyesore. Everyone wants the property to appreciate.

In one development I lived in there were some controls that seemed restrictive, but then you find out the whys. We could not have round garbage cans - good reason with the high winds, they rolled around too much. We had large garages (double, triple) and could not park overnight in the driveway for periods - no junk cars under repair.

In my present unit snow is taken care of, lawns are taken care of, I have my own landscaping and small garden and 3 - 20' pines and 3 - 35' ash trees plus a deer than wanders around and an ocasional raccoon.

Our development (lower cost units) of 12 - 4 units buildings is a little unusual, but not unique - we actually own our "share" of the "common" ground that is maintained (including trees to whatever degree you chose) by the association.

When you consider a purchase that has a home owners association, read the bylaws and talk to other residents. Look at the balance sheet of the association to determine what your share of the assets you will also acquire. After you buy, get involved, so it is done the way youe want it to be.

Dick

'...she couldn't build a fence or have a big dog...'
'...We could not have round garbage cans...'

These are the kind of rules I LOVE.
In the first case, people who like the same things get to find the right neighborhood [although, I admit, I would look for a development that banned small dogs, lawns, and any painted surface out of doors].

In the second case, the rule is for the convenience of all, including the new buyer who doesn't know abut the high winds.

The rock mulch issue is the kind of rule I hate. It's like those communities in Florida that banclotheslines. You have to have a clothes dryer in Florida?

[Though I would support a ban on drying white undergarments on a line.]

When my parents moved to town (small Kansas city of 10,000) in 1966, after living on a farm their whole life, they chose a subdivision that had restrictive covenants, much like a home owners association. Items controlled included:

No clotheslines
No outdoor TV antennas (and cable was not available at that time)
No outbuildings
No boats, campers, etc parked outside -- everything had to be in the garage
No parking of cars on the street overnight
All homes had to have utilities underground
Builders had to build homes progressively higher in cost as you went down the street

These restrictions were supposedly enforced by the developer and were in effect for a 30 year period. Since that time, the developer has died and the covenants have expired, but most folks appear to be abiding by their intent anyway.

One reason why I left Las Vegas NV for "someplace else" was that it seemed every single neighborhood was ruled by an HOA. Of course, the latest trend of building houses so close to each other that you couldn't fit a car between them helped too.

One person, who made the news, was a Vet who decided that after 9/11 he was going to fly his American flag at his new home on a daily basis. I believe that one went as far as the Supreme Court with him winning. His HOA wouldn't budge on the issue - "It's NOT allowed".

A friend of mine had to remove some Rose bushes that she had. "Red and/or white ONLY - those pink ones HAVE to be removed".

Another friend moved out of his because he got sick of the old biddy that was assigned to looking over everyone's back wall to "check on things".

Las Vegas has a bit of a rep for some pretty goofy, over-zealous HOAs.

I ended up where I did on an acre with open land and 2 neighbors. Down the street, they just built 33 houses on 9 acres with an HOA and tried to get us to join!

I told my one neighbor that my next paint job will be a few diagonal purple stripes on a lime green background littered with a few large orange polka-dots.

He knew I was joking but it sure would be fun to do one year.

Well, it's just like the local police dept. Lots of laws but is there enforcement? Ours is pretty easy on parking, even the home itself. They just want everything clean and neat--no visible junk. I'm just trying to get our HOA to turn off the yard watering on the 2 model homes at the entrance to the subdivision. We're in DFW area and it's hot and dry usually, but there's no need to water DAILY!! I guess that's the reasoning for having the crew of 10 "landscape technicians" parked out there working on the grounds every week.

Virginia must be close behind Las Vegas. The covenants for the HOA we used to live in was over 3 inches thick. You were 'required' to pay $100 ANNUALY in order to have your own copy of the 'updated' manual. (I guess a soft copy made too much sense.) When I went to sell my seven year old house, the HOA tried to prevent the settlement because they had lost the application and permit for the fence and deck that the original owner installed during construction. I'm not a fan of lawyers but the settlement attorney strongly persuaded the HOA rep that they could not afford the law suit that would be filed if they didn't change their position.

HOA's may be useful in theory, in practice they turn well meaning neighbors into nosey know-it-alls.
Tree

Most HOs have no legal recourse if you choose to not follow the rules. What are they going to do? Take you house away from you?

If not mistaken some HOA can attach a lien to your property for unpaid dues and the cost to rectify uncompliant property.

In addition for a lien for lack of association fee payments, an association can also do the same for unpaid fines and charges according to a schedule in the association.

Our association can do this has never leined for fines and miscellaneous charges, but it was instituted to spur the owners of rented units to keep the tenants under control. Usually it just takes one warning to the owner to keep things in order.

Regarding the non-payment of the association fees, if an association does not enforce non-payment with a lein, they could be construed as not managing the expenses and protecting the investment of the owners that do pay.

When we bought our townhouse, I was surprised to find that there was an asset in the reserve fund attched to the unit that was $3000. - That is just like a discount, windfall investment or prepayment on maintenance.

Our association is still in the control of the developer who is not spending the money on the things he should be. I think out of 48 homes two pay the yearly dues. He can and does place liens on the property for the on paid dues but it is $150 a year so he could do it for 10 years and if we sell we will be out $1500. Big deal. Also there is no schedule of fines for no compliance written in our charter so people pretty much do as they please. This works well for our neighbor hood. I would say 75% of the residents have no interest in a association of any type.

Ryan -

I can see that your association cannot be effective because it has no obligations and the dues are low. It was just a vehicle to help the builder get approval for the project.

Our 48 unit townhouse (quad homes) association is a little different. The dues are $125/mo (less than most around here ), and they include exterior maintenance, driveway mantenance, lawn care, snow plowing and shoveling, tree trimmming and building insurance. With the close living, you need something to police and look over things.

Ryan -

I can see that your association cannot be effective because it has no obligations and the dues are low. It was just a vehicle to help the builder get approval for the project.



yep thank God!......

how do you get rid of homeowners association?

You get all the property owners to agree. They might be able to dissolve the association. I don't think a majority will fly when it comes to property. This is especially true if there is any property held in common that could benefit an individual owner. Once you own property, that is an indivual right and asset that a person can protect or maintain the conditions it was bought under.

If you bought a property that had requirements or benefits of a HOA, you agreed to the stipulation, just as you are obligated to other property rights and onligations.

You could hire an attorney if you think you can find one to work on it.

Dick

how do you get rid of homeowners association?

Read your cc&rs. Look under amendments and termination.
Many hoas have a life of about 20 years, then if not voted out, automatically renew for maybe another ten years before a vote is required again. Read them carefully, and note what percentage of affirmative votes are needed.
Mine say something like 90% of votes cast for termination need to be affirmative to kill the hoa, and there is a time limit--within a certain amount of time from anniversary of date of incorporation. (Check your state corporation department)

If you have no to few common areas, you are in better shape than if there are buildings, pools, courts, etc.
Sometimes you can give green areas to the city/county/state, sometimes you might just deed them to the nearest homeowner. For other things, maybe you can dismantle and give away or sell items. (playground equipment)

Most HOs have no legal recourse if you choose to not follow the rules. What are they going to do? Take you house away from you?

what they'll do is find ways to fine you and keep fining you and if you don't pay put a lean on your property until you do.

I live in a neighborhood with a HOA, of which I'm the treasurer.. We don't dictate what color to paint the house or curtains, but we do deny fences and large out-buildings.. Our dues are used to pay for the road upkeep, beaches, and insurance.. Not all HOAs are dictatorial..

If you have friends on the board, and being treasurer i'm sure you do, the rules simply don't apply to you. God Bless America