Electronic Alarms and Home Security Devices - Help with fire/co detector planning

I finally installed my system and now would like to add fire/co detection.

Local law in NYC requires co detector to be installed withing 15 ft of the sleeping area. If I installed it in the master bedroom, will it be effective behind the closed doors? I do not realistically expect to get co on the second floor, but if I'm going to spend the money, it might as well be effective.

I wanted to put CO detector in the basement, near the heaters, 'cause that's where I'd expect the problem to be. Is it a good idea? How close to the heaters can it be located?

The installation manual for the control panel shows kitchen equipped with heat detector instead of the fire alarm. What the reason for that? I'm particularly concerned with false fire alarms due to the various cooking activities. My wife sets off existing fire detector (not connected to anything) once in a while. I certainly don't want fire dept breaking down the front door every time something gets too fried. :eek:

Try this link (http://www.macurco.com/FAQ.html), they are one of the industry standards for the alarm system compatible CO detectors.

For kitchens, and other high humidity or dirty areas a heat detector is a much better choice. Also, do not install smoke detectors right in front of the bathroom door, especially if anyone in the home has a fondness for mega-steamy showers.

Basically a smoke detector cannot tell the difference between moisture condensing in it's interior, and actual smoke. Both product the same degree of effective obscuration in the air.

Also, there is a feature called alarm verification on most alarms. You can set the system to basically reset itself for a minute, and check again. If it still senses smoke, _then_ it goes into alarm.

Basically a smoke detector cannot tell the difference between moisture condensing in it's interior, and actual smoke. Both product the same degree of effective obscuration in the air.


I actually have a smoke/co detector about 2ft away from the bathroom door and it never game me any problems. The door is usually closed when we use the bathroom.


Also, there is a feature called alarm verification on most alarms. You can set the system to basically reset itself for a minute, and check again. If it still senses smoke, _then_ it goes into alarm.

I have that feature but the manual says it cannot be used in UL listed installations. I'm not sure if I care about that but more importantly, if it goes off once, 1 minute will not be enough to get rid of all the smoke completely.

Also, I'm not exactly clear on CO detector placement. I understood that it shouldn't be installed in the garage because there's not ventilation in there. However, the heaters exhaust normally goes into the vent. Does it mean it's ok to install a detector near the heaters?

Thanks for the response.

Whether you have problems with bathroom door effects on a smoke has a lot to do with the combination of personal habits (keeping the door closed) and the natural air circulation in the structure, also the age of the device (some become more sensitive as they age, other's less so). _All_ smoke detector manufacturers identify that as a prime location for the generation of false trips.

The UL listed installation standards has more to do with indemnification of professional installations. Those are the standards that must be met for an installer's liability insurance to kick in, primarily in commercial installations. In fact, in todays climate of false alarm fines, the verification feature is being _required_ in an increasing number of localities.

The CO detectors do the most good in the vicinity of the sleeping quarters. If you are concerned with CO being generated by the heating equipment itself, most makers have an optional housing that lets you mount the device to the ductwork, thus detecting CO in the climate control airstream. Placing a detector next to the actual furnace is basically a waste of time and hardware.
Most CO incidents in residences come about due to improperly maintained heat exchangers that allow combustion products to mix with the airstream.

Whether you have problems with bathroom door effects on a smoke has a lot to do with the combination of personal habits (keeping the door closed) and the natural air circulation in the structure, also the age of the device (some become more sensitive as they age, other's less so). _All_ smoke detector manufacturers identify that as a prime location for the generation of false trips.

Does it react to high humidity or the actual steam? I'll tell you why I'm resilient to change that location - it's a little hallway (about 8'x8') and it's the only common area between the 3 bedrooms. Anywhere in that hallway will be close to the bathroom. Plus, the original builder put a filre detector there and there's a box in the ceiling for it.


The UL listed installation standards has more to do with indemnification of professional installations. Those are the standards that must be met for an installer's liability insurance to kick in, primarily in commercial installations. In fact, in todays climate of false alarm fines, the verification feature is being _required_ in an increasing number of localities.


That's good to know. However, I'm not sure it will help. The manual says RF detector will resend the signal every 60 seconds, and the second signal will act as a confirmation. And, like I said, 60 seconds, wouldn't be enough to get rid of the smoke. Although once we put an exhaust in the kitchen in the summer, it might not be an issue anymore.


The CO detectors do the most good in the vicinity of the sleeping quarters. If you are concerned with CO being generated by the heating equipment itself, most makers have an optional housing that lets you mount the device to the ductwork, thus detecting CO in the climate control airstream. Placing a detector next to the actual furnace is basically a waste of time and hardware.
Most CO incidents in residences come about due to improperly maintained heat exchangers that allow combustion products to mix with the airstream.

Ok, I can see why you'd want it near the sleeping area. But wouldn't you want one where you spend the rest of your day? In the most recent case of co poisoning that comes to mind, there workers forgot to take the cover of the heater vent, so the exhaust went back and they all got killed in their living room during the day. Granted, I do not know much about the internals of the heating systems but wouldn't CO on the first floor or the basement help more in this case?

They can and do react to both steam and humidity. Again, there are many variables depending on the microclimate of your home's interior. If you have had no issues with standard consumer grade Ion detectors, then you are probably ok. I can only provide the standards recommended by the manufacturers and experience.

The wireless smokes send a _supervision_ signal every 60 seconds. The verification time can be varied on most system (the Networx NX-8 allows 120 to 255 seconds delay, for example).

There is no limit to how many CO detectors you choose to install. The only issue is the power limits of your panel, and your budget.

The wireless smokes send a _supervision_ signal every 60 seconds. The verification time can be varied on most system (the Networx NX-8 allows 120 to 255 seconds delay, for example).

Here's what the manual says:

RF smoke detectors repeat the alarm transmission every 60 seconds as long as they are detecting smoke. This repeated transmission will serve as the second zone trip, causing the alarm to be reported. If a restoral is sent between alarm transmissions, the process starts over.

Am I not understanding it correctly?

With smoke detector verification, the system throws the detector into a forced reset for the time period set, and will not trigger an alarm until the time duration expires. Again, the details of this feature will vary depending on brand and model of conctol.

There are a few reasons why the detector is located near bedrooms. The traditional one, I believe, was so the alarm tone would be close enough sleeping people they'd wake up. Your detector runs to the main siren though, right?

There are a few reasons why the detector is located near bedrooms. The traditional one, I believe, was so the alarm tone would be close enough sleeping people they'd wake up. Your detector runs to the main siren though, right?

That was my thinking to begin with - I kind of assumed that there'd be nothing to detect on the second floor and the requirement was there just to be able to hear it. But, if I understand it correctly, it's just more effective in the sleeping area so I guess I'm going to install it in one of the bedrooms.