finished basement resale value

[jasper_60103]

I'm planning to finish my basement, but I'm still deciding whether to add an additional bedroom or kitchenette (mini kitchen) to the space.
A shower bathroom is already in the plans, so another bedroom would probably be a good choice, but I have 4 bedrooms (not fully utilized) already. And more children are not in the plans. The kitchenette would have a fridge, microwave, sink and cabinetry. So this would be a nice convenience.

The basement space is good size, but wouldn't nicely accomodate both features. So my question is, which would bring greater resale value? Which would be bigger pluses, the kitchenette or the bedroom? I know these questions are probably best answered by a real estate agent, but I would like to here some opinions from this forum as well.
thanks,
-jasper

[majakdragon]

You asked for opinions so here are mine.
I am assuming you aleady know you are dealing with local codes either way you go. Bedroom: Egress and electrical codes. Kitchen: Plumbing and electrical codes.
Since you are already planning a bathroom I think the kitchenette would fit in and could be accomplished while you are doing plumbing and electrical anyways.
You have 4 bedrooms and although I don't know what is selling in your area I don't believe a 5th is going to be as appealing as a recreation /family/party room with the amenities you are planning.
Just MY opinion. Good luck with your projects.

[slumlordfrank]

Well, I've read your post 5 times now and I guess like majakdragon I'm making an assumption here: The space is big enough for (1) a shower bathroom (2) either a kitchenette or a bedroom and (3) another fairly good sized room such as a rec room/den/rumpus room?

I'm guessing that the shower bathroom is on the order of 5'-6' X 9'-10'.

A decent kitchenette could be done in an area not much bigger, the "ette" means small. In 35 years I've lived in places with kitchen that size and didn't find them difficult to accomodate our lifestyle. What is the purpose of this kitchenette? Is is so you have cold drinks, a microwave for popcorn and a sink for cleaning up after parties without hauling stuff upstairs to the kitchen? Or, is is so you can rent out the basement area to college students or young couples?

That leaves the rest of the basement to do "other". If you're planning on a rec room instead of a bedroom why not build in an "adaptable" closet. Really a closet is the only thing that I can see that makes a bedroom a bedroom. If you enclose all of your entertainment stuff in a "closet" you can call it a "media center", but if the next owner has 9 kids they can call it a "closet".

There are very few places that 5 bedroom homes are often seen, Utah comes to mind, so I don't see much enhanced value from just a bedroom. OTOH, a kitchenette for much more that the "party enhancer" may be a waste of money.

Good luck.

Frank

[razz]

There is a small but significant subset of buyers who are looking for a "granny flat" to accomodate a boarder, student, relative, au pair, etc. In most cases, 4-br and 5-br homes don't meet this requirement, and a separate "apartment" is sought. If your plans include a private entrance (and it should if it meets egress codes), then your house will make a real find for such a buyer.

[jasper_60103]

Thanks for your comments.

Just to follow-up on some of your questions:

1) Meeting the local codes wouldn't be a problem for adding a bedroom and/or kitchenette.

2) The proposed bedroom including a closet would measure 15' x 13'. I do have an entertainment area (15' x 36'). Without adding a bedroom, my entertainment area woud be 15' x 49', which is a nice large open space. In addition, I still have a good size storage room and utility room, which will remain unfinished.

3) Yes, the kitchenette could be easily added since its near plumbing for the bath. It would be small, measuring only 9' x 4'. I already have a 2nd fridge, which I use for additional food storage.

4) The proposed bedroom would not be for rental use or an in-law arrangement. I foresee my kids possibly using it if they live at home while in college.

Another option would be to rough-in the bedroom space, so a room can easily be constructed if the need arises. I think I like this idea.

What do you think?

-jasper

[slumlordfrank]

"4) The proposed bedroom would not be for rental use or an in-law arrangement. I foresee my kids possibly using it if they live at home while in college."

Possibly, although by that time both you and them will be ready for them to go, no matter how much you love them, lol. Although you could do like my Mom and Dad did, as we left home, me-Air Force, two brothers to college, my Mom rented out our bedrooms to university students. It not only provided homey accomodations for the students and a few bucks for my 'rents, IT PREVENTED ANY OF US FROM BOOMERANGING!

"Another option would be to rough-in the bedroom space, so a room can easily be constructed if the need arises. I think I like this idea."

Yep, might save a couple of bucks this way. Another option might be to do as the builder of our current house did. The two "off" bedrooms are at the opposite end of the house from the master BR and kitchen. They built those two rooms with their common wall being a "movable wall". It's a very high quality, 6' wide, 80" tall, accordion door. Look at the panels that move around in hotel ballrooms to make those areas larger and smaller to accomodate different size groups for conferences and meetings, etc. Same thing on a smaller scale, matches the wood trim exactly. At the time they built it was a real possiblity that a parent might be coming to live with in a few years and this gave the option of a bedroom with an adjoining living area, so the parent could have their own space, other than a bedroom.

Frank

[jasper_60103]

Thanks frank. You definitely provided food for thought.
-jasper

[tlogan]

Here's my 2 cents worth (first post, but been lurking for awhile)....

I've never made improvements to my home with resale value in mind. I always make improvements with our lifestyle in mind. If you do this, you will take more care in how the project is done and probably use better material. If it's a job that you WANT done, overall, it will be done better, becaue YOU have to live with it. When it comes time to sell, this will show. Maybe I think this way because I happen to live in a HOT Housing Market (Loudoun County, VA - the fastest growing county in the country) and there is a buyer for EVERY house, no matter what it looks like. BUT, we just moved there two years ago and looked at over 30 houses before we found this one. MANY of them had REAL BAD remodeling efforts (basement finishes, kitchen upgrades, etc) of various stages of completeness, obviously trying to up the market value for resale. And it SHOWS. Cheap cabinets, halffast drywalling.....

I am currently in the planing stages of my basement re-model, and I think at this point that the only "for the future" thing I might have done is to add an egress window for a future bedroom. Right now, it will be a large storage area, but all the rest is for what we want NOW....a second family/home theater room, wet bar, game table (probably poker!), coat closet, LOTS of easy access storage/pantry shelves and a full bath (all the drains are already roughed in). This would leave the large storage area easy to finish for us or the next owner.

In the meatime, we'll be enjoying our house the way we want it, not worrying about what some nut in the future MAY want.

Good luck !!!

[jasper_60103]

tlogan:
thanks for your comments. I've seen some really bad houses during my house search as well. I recently purchased my home 6 months ago and don't plan on moving (at least anytime soon). Your point is well taken about planning for current use. I think we're kinda on the same page. I want to enjoy and enhance my living space for now, BUT keep resale in mind. I live in Minnesota in a growing area south of the twin cities, but its not the hot market you're living in. One thing I need to keep in mind is many of my neighbors have the same model house, and it would be beneficial to make my house more unique and desirable. Or at the very least, don't do any harm. Right now, I'm leaning more towards adding the mini kitchen and NOt adding the additional bedroom since it's really of no value for my family. Also, I would enjoy the mini kitchen and I don't think many of my neighbors will add this feature. BTW, I got the idea from a remodel I saw on the web: http://www.absoluteremodeling.com/EastonLowerLevel.html. Pretty cool, huh?

I like your plans, especially keeping some storage space. I'm planning to do the same. I think people tend to overlook the idea of keeping ample space for storage during their remodels.
Thanks again for your input and Good luck with your project.
-jasper

[tlogan]

jasper -

Yeah, sounds like we're pretty much on the same page.

The remodel in that link looks fabulous, but PRICEY!!!!!!! I don't think it will add to the resale value the 55-65K that the builder says it costs, though. I too have a second fridge (wife cooks...a LOT) and we entertain. There is NO storage for party platters in a side-by-side. So, I have to figure a place for it. My space will be about half of what's in that link. And hopefully since I'm planning it as DIY project, a WHOLE LOT LESS!

Are you planning to DIY? If so, future changes should be easier since you will know how everything was done, and more importantly, "what's behind that wall!"

Once I really get going, I'll be posting pics, etc. First thing is to cleanup and build storage shelves for all the junk that's down there now. Gotta start somewhere!

Good luck on your project! I'll be looking for progress pics etc.

Tlogan
The Man Without an Interesting Moniker

[jasper_60103]

Tlogan:
yeah, I don't have budget to do a $50-60K basement either. And you're right, you probably couldn't recover that kind of expense on resale.

I have several estimates for finishing my basement from general contractors, and they were more than I wanted to spend. So, now I'm thinking about doing some of the work myself to save some money.
I figure I could learn to frame and insulate it myself. My builder framed a good portion of the space already. Besides, its a good project to do with my teenage son.
Also, I could do the electrical work myself since I'm electrical engineer. I never wired an entire room before, but I think I can handle it. My builder ran a couple circuits to the box already for my future basement, but I may need to run a couple more for GFI in bath/kitchenette.

The other work i.e. plumbing, HVAC, drywall, carpeting, etc... I would seek professional help for. FYI. Like yours, my bath is rough-in as well.

Is it difficult to manage and contract work out the yourself?
Any help/pointers in this area would be appreciated, since I never done this before. Also, I have taken some pics of my bare basement. I'll post them soon. Thanks.

-jasper

[caleyg]

jasper something you wrote jumped out at me. Be careful of those walls your builder already framed for you. In my case those were load bearing walls. If you just leave them as they are, you'll be fine to drywall them or whatever. But don't attempt to move, remove, or put doorways in them without knowing for sure what you're doing.

[jasper_60103]

caleyg:
There is one wall parallel along the stairway, and I was thinking about converting it to a half wall. I posed the question to the contractors (I received estimates from) about whether it was load bearing or not. Some said no and others were'nt sure. The wall does run parallel to the floor joists above, but I understand there are other factors to consider. I'll ask my builder or a structural engineer to be certain.

Thanks for the tip.

-jasper

[barkowkj]

unless your basement has exterior access it can not be considered as living space which means an addtional bedroom in the basement will not effect the price of the house at all. although it is always nice and may appeal to a family with alot of kids, but u already have 4 bedrooms.

that bathroom in the basement does add to the home value as does all plumpling that is brought down to the basement.

i would recommend putting in the kitchenette and especially with a working sink...........that would really appeal too alot of home buyers who use there basements as rec rooms......which almost everybody does

then again you could always go crazy and put in a bar too with the kitenette behind it with a larger than usual walking space in between say 6 ft.

[barkowkj]

this can be a do it your self project, but you might want to call in a pro for the plumbing of course. a fairly good size wall can be turned into a kitchenette very easily. box it out and slap a counter top on top of it. under the counter you can do something very simple for storage such as two long shelves running the whole distance underneth and some doors on the front


or if thats too hard you can build and attach a brace for the counter top only and attach it to the wall, put a sink in the countertop and put two shelves underneith running the entire distance and run a curtain on the front to hide it all.

if u choose the 2nd way it will only look as cheap as you let it look. you would be saving some money and could buy a nicer counter top maybe even a special order so that it would be cut to size already. attach the curtain rod directly underneith the counter top. pick a good curtain that matches the countertop...sink....and entire basement sceme and in the end it will look pretty classy!!! but best of all if u build a bar too the bar will hide everything behind it...


a bar is even easier to build

you just build a narrow box and put a countertop on top......buy the countertop that does not have a back splash

if you know or are willing you can cut the counter top yourself and have a taller countertop on front and a shorter one in the back.....you just need a small ledge on the front, big enough for a glass and behind the bar underneith you can make even more storage


my basement has a bar with a sink and shelves behind it and underneith it , that we did ourselves with no plans and not alot of money. we even did the plumbing ourselves because the estimates we got were outrageous. we have alot of the home depot do-it-yourself books and it turned out great

[kracky]

I have a walkout basement and I am in the process of doing it. I have all the studs up and waiting for the electrician to wire the whole basement. I am in the process of doing the full bath right now. I guess I consider myself lucky, because I have a couple of friends that are license electrician and a builder to come and guide me as to what the codes are. I am also planning to put a mini kitchen in the future. I do not drink so I am leaning on not having a bar. Yes, if you do not have a door that leads to the outside it does not consider a living spaces. I agree with you to enjoy the house and do what you want to do for yourself and not for the future owner.

Good luck on your project!!!

[jasper_60103]

I believe finishing a basement is a economical way to add enjoyable (or needed) living space to your home. For example, I had some bids done for building a (12'x12') 4season porch and finishing my (850sq ft) basement. The porch cost about 4 times as much (per square foot) as finishing my entire basement w/mini-kitchen & bath! Personally, I couldn't justify spending more money for a small 4season room than my entire basement remodel.
But appraisers would probably count this small addition as additional living space (or value) rather than my finished basement.

In general, appraisals give lower value to lower-level rooms compared to the rest of your house, some say 40-70% for walk-outs, even less for other types. I don't think this is always fair, especially considering the dollars folks are pumping into basements these days.
In any case, I agree with you. I plan to finish my basement for my family's enjoyment, not as an investment. Thanks.

-jasper