Designing Kitchens and Bathrooms - Glass shower panel
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walks
09-08-04, 11:16 PM
Can anyone give me a step-by-step approach to installing a glass shower panel?
The glass is 1/2" tempered, about 4' wide, 5' high. The bottom will sit on a shower curb and both the bottom and sides will be mounted with 3/4" U-channel. The finished curb and walls are porcelain tile.
Do I need to fasten the U-channel at regular intervals, which would require drilling through the porcelain (very difficult), or can I just screw in wherever there is a convenient grout line? Once the channels are in, do I then apply the silicone sealant, or does that come after the glass is in place? Is the sealant applied to just the bottom of the channel or to the inner sides as well?
I presume the only way to get the glass in is to lift it up and drop it in vertically from above, since there are channels on both sides. The ceilings are high, so it won't be a problem -- except for the weight of the glass (140 lbs.)--, but... if the silicone is applied first, won't it rub off as the glass is dropped into place? Is there a special type of channel that you can put the glass in place first, then the channel?
What is the best type of silicone to use and where to get it??
THANK YOU for any help.
I have called at least a dozen glass dealers in town, but they can't get to the installation for 3-4 weeks!!! I have a tough time even getting an estimate from these guys, and most won't even return my calls. Two or 3 that I managed to talk with quoted me $200-300 for installation -- they said it would take 2 guys about an hour and a half. Talk about the business to be in -- these guys make $100/hour and are backlogged for 4 weeks. Why bother going to college!!
The glass is 1/2" tempered, about 4' wide, 5' high. The bottom will sit on a shower curb and both the bottom and sides will be mounted with 3/4" U-channel. The finished curb and walls are porcelain tile.
Do I need to fasten the U-channel at regular intervals, which would require drilling through the porcelain (very difficult), or can I just screw in wherever there is a convenient grout line? Once the channels are in, do I then apply the silicone sealant, or does that come after the glass is in place? Is the sealant applied to just the bottom of the channel or to the inner sides as well?
I presume the only way to get the glass in is to lift it up and drop it in vertically from above, since there are channels on both sides. The ceilings are high, so it won't be a problem -- except for the weight of the glass (140 lbs.)--, but... if the silicone is applied first, won't it rub off as the glass is dropped into place? Is there a special type of channel that you can put the glass in place first, then the channel?
What is the best type of silicone to use and where to get it??
THANK YOU for any help.
I have called at least a dozen glass dealers in town, but they can't get to the installation for 3-4 weeks!!! I have a tough time even getting an estimate from these guys, and most won't even return my calls. Two or 3 that I managed to talk with quoted me $200-300 for installation -- they said it would take 2 guys about an hour and a half. Talk about the business to be in -- these guys make $100/hour and are backlogged for 4 weeks. Why bother going to college!!
Snoonyb
09-09-04, 07:05 PM
Get some help to lift and set the glass.
Using a square and a long strait edge, make sure that the wall that you are attaching to is square with the shower dam.
Yes you can insert the fasteners through the grout lines, however, the masonry bit may have a tendency to wander.
Any fasteners used, MUST have their heads set level with the surface of the channel.
Since you didn't mention a gasket having been provided, obtain and install enough pillow blocks,(5) should be sufficient, two for the lower and three for the vertical.
For the bottom channel, set one of the pillow blocks near the end, away from the wall.
You can apply your choice of caulking, I prefer polyseamseal because it is user friendly, now or after the glass is set.
With a helper, lift and set the glass into the bottom channel, away from the wall channel.
Tilting it away slightly at the top, slide it into the corner, and gently allow it to fall into place. Making sure that it is resting fully on the bottom pillow blocks, using tile wedges, center the glass in the channels and finish the caulking.
Using a square and a long strait edge, make sure that the wall that you are attaching to is square with the shower dam.
Yes you can insert the fasteners through the grout lines, however, the masonry bit may have a tendency to wander.
Any fasteners used, MUST have their heads set level with the surface of the channel.
Since you didn't mention a gasket having been provided, obtain and install enough pillow blocks,(5) should be sufficient, two for the lower and three for the vertical.
For the bottom channel, set one of the pillow blocks near the end, away from the wall.
You can apply your choice of caulking, I prefer polyseamseal because it is user friendly, now or after the glass is set.
With a helper, lift and set the glass into the bottom channel, away from the wall channel.
Tilting it away slightly at the top, slide it into the corner, and gently allow it to fall into place. Making sure that it is resting fully on the bottom pillow blocks, using tile wedges, center the glass in the channels and finish the caulking.
walks
09-12-04, 06:59 PM
There are channels on both sides, therefore your technique will not work (please see original question).
What is a pillow block?
Where is the caulk applied?
Thank you.
What is a pillow block?
Where is the caulk applied?
Thank you.
Snoonyb
09-12-04, 08:31 PM
You're correct.
So forget the vertical channel part.
However, you will now need two channels that are sufficiently longer than the height of the glass panel, plus the pillow blocks, to provide for a fastener at the top of each vertical leg.
They need to be prefitted and drilled.
As I said,"You can apply your choice of caulking, I prefer polyseamseal because it is user friendly, now or after the glass is set."
Where? where ever you feel will provide the best seal.
Follow the instructions about shinning.
The vertical channels are temporarily attached to the glass prior to setting the glass,than attached using the pre-drilled holes
Pillow blocks are little rubber pads found at the glass supplier from whom you purchased the glass, I'll let them explain it to you.
So forget the vertical channel part.
However, you will now need two channels that are sufficiently longer than the height of the glass panel, plus the pillow blocks, to provide for a fastener at the top of each vertical leg.
They need to be prefitted and drilled.
As I said,"You can apply your choice of caulking, I prefer polyseamseal because it is user friendly, now or after the glass is set."
Where? where ever you feel will provide the best seal.
Follow the instructions about shinning.
The vertical channels are temporarily attached to the glass prior to setting the glass,than attached using the pre-drilled holes
Pillow blocks are little rubber pads found at the glass supplier from whom you purchased the glass, I'll let them explain it to you.
walks
09-13-04, 05:56 AM
Well, thanks for trying. But your explanation has not helped me yet.
What is 'shinning', and where would I find instructions about shinning?
You said, "The vertical channels are temporarily attached to the glass prior to setting the glass,than attached using the pre-drilled holes". How are the channels temporarily attached to the glass? What is the next step? When and how are they permanently attached? And how are the channels attached to the walls except at the one pre-drilled hole at the top of each vertical channel?
And what about the bottom channel. Is this installed first?
I'm having a hard time visualizing your explanation. Step-by-step details would be greatly appreciated. If I already knew what all the terms you're using meant, I would not need to come to this web site. Sorry for being a pain. Thank you in advance if you'd like to try again.
What is 'shinning', and where would I find instructions about shinning?
You said, "The vertical channels are temporarily attached to the glass prior to setting the glass,than attached using the pre-drilled holes". How are the channels temporarily attached to the glass? What is the next step? When and how are they permanently attached? And how are the channels attached to the walls except at the one pre-drilled hole at the top of each vertical channel?
And what about the bottom channel. Is this installed first?
I'm having a hard time visualizing your explanation. Step-by-step details would be greatly appreciated. If I already knew what all the terms you're using meant, I would not need to come to this web site. Sorry for being a pain. Thank you in advance if you'd like to try again.
Doug Aleshire
09-13-04, 06:45 AM
walks,
It sounds as though you are installing side and bottom rails as that of installing a pre-manufactured shower enclosure.
A picture is worth a thousand words and is less confusing, hope these do it,
http://www.crystallineimages.com/HT_Uchan.htm
http://www.cwglass.com/instructions/shower/6000H4545.pdf (this may provide better pictures of the application you describe)
http://www.crystallineimages.com/HT_Install_Door.htm (you may not need this but I added it)
Hope this helps!
It sounds as though you are installing side and bottom rails as that of installing a pre-manufactured shower enclosure.
A picture is worth a thousand words and is less confusing, hope these do it,
http://www.crystallineimages.com/HT_Uchan.htm
http://www.cwglass.com/instructions/shower/6000H4545.pdf (this may provide better pictures of the application you describe)
http://www.crystallineimages.com/HT_Install_Door.htm (you may not need this but I added it)
Hope this helps!
Snoonyb
09-13-04, 12:40 PM
So, we'll start over.
You have a 4'x5', 1/2" thick piece of tempered plate glass, sufficient 3/4" "U" channel to provide for bottom and side application and not being experienced in glazing, you propose to lift the glass and insert it into an affixed frame constructed from the channel, from the top.
Assuming, because you say you have sufficient vertical ceiling height, 10' 8" minimum, with a 6" shower dam. 10' 2" without a dam.
Proceeding upon that premise, as previously stated,"Yes you can insert the fasteners through the grout lines, however, the masonry bit may have a tendency to wander.
Any fasteners used, MUST have their heads set level with the surface of the channel."
Since you didn't mention a gasket having been provided, obtain and install enough pillow blocks for this type of installation.
Cut, drill and countersink the bottom channel to fit. Mark the tile, using a center punch, small nailset or drift punch, score the surface of the tile breaking the glaze, drill and insert your plastic anchors, apply a bead of caulking, set and fasten this bottom track.
Place, level and mark the vertical or side channel and following the same method as suggested for the bottom channel, install these.
Not to suggest any thing other than that the following will afford some stability to the process;
Gather together, three able bodied helpers, 4ea 4' step ladders, 2 lengths of scaffold planking, at least six of the suction devices used to handle glass (at the moment the name escapes me), a blanket, and leather gloves for everyone.
Place the folded blanket adjacent to the channeled opening, move the glass, setting it on the blanket and placing a rag between the glass and where it rests against at the top.
Using the four ladders and two scaffold boards, set a pair of ladders, one pair on the inside and one pair on the outside of the channeled opening. At the three foot height, place the scaffold boards, one each.
Place and stabilize these platforms as near to the channeled opening as possible.
Cut and place two pillow blocks within three inches of the ends of the bottom channel.
Liberally caulk the intersections of the bottom and vertical channels.
At these intersections, cut and install one each, for both sides, a pillow block in the vertical or side channels.
As I said,"You can apply your choice of caulking, I prefer polyseamseal because it is user friendly, now or after the glass is set."
Place and space, three of the glass handling devices on each side of the glass panel in such a manner to maintain complete control of the panel.
With all four people lifting, one on each platform and two on the floor, lift and place the glass in the vertical or side channel and gently lower too rest upon the bottom pillow blocks making certain that the side pillow blocks remain in place between the glass an the channel surface.
Place two more pillow blocks near the top of the channel, one on each side.
Using tile wedges, center the glass in the channels and finish the caulking.
Again,"Pillow blocks are little rubber pads found at the glass supplier from whom you purchased the glass, I'll let them explain it to you."
You have a 4'x5', 1/2" thick piece of tempered plate glass, sufficient 3/4" "U" channel to provide for bottom and side application and not being experienced in glazing, you propose to lift the glass and insert it into an affixed frame constructed from the channel, from the top.
Assuming, because you say you have sufficient vertical ceiling height, 10' 8" minimum, with a 6" shower dam. 10' 2" without a dam.
Proceeding upon that premise, as previously stated,"Yes you can insert the fasteners through the grout lines, however, the masonry bit may have a tendency to wander.
Any fasteners used, MUST have their heads set level with the surface of the channel."
Since you didn't mention a gasket having been provided, obtain and install enough pillow blocks for this type of installation.
Cut, drill and countersink the bottom channel to fit. Mark the tile, using a center punch, small nailset or drift punch, score the surface of the tile breaking the glaze, drill and insert your plastic anchors, apply a bead of caulking, set and fasten this bottom track.
Place, level and mark the vertical or side channel and following the same method as suggested for the bottom channel, install these.
Not to suggest any thing other than that the following will afford some stability to the process;
Gather together, three able bodied helpers, 4ea 4' step ladders, 2 lengths of scaffold planking, at least six of the suction devices used to handle glass (at the moment the name escapes me), a blanket, and leather gloves for everyone.
Place the folded blanket adjacent to the channeled opening, move the glass, setting it on the blanket and placing a rag between the glass and where it rests against at the top.
Using the four ladders and two scaffold boards, set a pair of ladders, one pair on the inside and one pair on the outside of the channeled opening. At the three foot height, place the scaffold boards, one each.
Place and stabilize these platforms as near to the channeled opening as possible.
Cut and place two pillow blocks within three inches of the ends of the bottom channel.
Liberally caulk the intersections of the bottom and vertical channels.
At these intersections, cut and install one each, for both sides, a pillow block in the vertical or side channels.
As I said,"You can apply your choice of caulking, I prefer polyseamseal because it is user friendly, now or after the glass is set."
Place and space, three of the glass handling devices on each side of the glass panel in such a manner to maintain complete control of the panel.
With all four people lifting, one on each platform and two on the floor, lift and place the glass in the vertical or side channel and gently lower too rest upon the bottom pillow blocks making certain that the side pillow blocks remain in place between the glass an the channel surface.
Place two more pillow blocks near the top of the channel, one on each side.
Using tile wedges, center the glass in the channels and finish the caulking.
Again,"Pillow blocks are little rubber pads found at the glass supplier from whom you purchased the glass, I'll let them explain it to you."
walks
09-14-04, 07:36 AM
Thank you for the help and information.
I also found a web site that is great for do-it-yourself shower glass:
http://www.wilsonglass.net/
It gives some good tips on drilling for securing the U-channel. I'm using some pretty tough porcelain tile which is hard to drill. Yes, I'll use the grout spaces when I can, but they're not always conveniently placed.
Thanks again.
walks
I also found a web site that is great for do-it-yourself shower glass:
http://www.wilsonglass.net/
It gives some good tips on drilling for securing the U-channel. I'm using some pretty tough porcelain tile which is hard to drill. Yes, I'll use the grout spaces when I can, but they're not always conveniently placed.
Thanks again.
walks