Outdoor Power Equipment and Small Engines - Diaphram Carb & Engine Running Problems (Merged Threads - Tripper)

Hello,

I'm working on a Simplicity 'Wonder-Boy' riding mower - ID 003494

It has a BS motor on it - 130202 0436 01

It has the carb where it has pipes going into the fule tank. The choke has an assembly that can be controlled with a lever when you are sitting on the mower.

Its missing some parts and is not really connected right now.

Does anyone know where I can get a view of what the assembly looks like when hooked up properly?

Also, what hp is that motor? Can't find anything on it.

Thanks

Tripper

Hello: Tripper

Try searching for pictures and information needed on the Briggs web site.
The web site address is contained within the link below:
Engine Codes: ...(Engine Manufacturer Web Sites Included)
http://forum.doityourself.com/showthread.php?t=68787

Also try this web site link:
Outdoor Power Products:
http://forum.doityourself.com/showthread.php?t=154584

Another potential source is the local small engine repair shops in your area. As well as any lawn mower and or lawn tractor dealer for that brand. These businesses will be located and listed in the phone book.

The businesses mentioned above will or should have the needed parts. Since parts may be missing, you can obtain them there. And these shops and or sealers may also provide a copy of the parts and how they are to be installed, so the choke works correctly.

Additional Suggestions:
The other resident small engine service and repair professionals in the forum may be able to offer additional suggestions, advice & help.

Check back on your question several times over the next few days for additional replies.

Small engine repair parts, generic repair manuals and additional help are all available at all local small engine repair shops and or lawn mower repair shops in your area. Shops and dealers are listed in the phone book directory.

Regards & Good Luck. Sharp Advice.
Master Small Engine Tech. Web Site Host, Forums Monitor and Multiple Topics Moderator. "Accurate Power Equipment Company." Small Engine Diagnostics Services & Repair. Fast...Fair...Friendly & Highly Proficient Services....:D

Additional sources for manuals and or replacement parts:

BILLIOU'S 1-209-784-4102

L.S.THORPE CO. INC. 1-617-776-2445

FOLEY-BELSAW COMPANY 1-816-483-4200

OEM Manufacturers Web Sites:

http://www.briggsandstratton.com/

Disclaimer:
I do not have any affiliations nor vested interests in any of these retail parts suppliers above. Provided solely to assist with locating parts.

I've got a Pulsa-jet carb on a BS motor. The choke is at the end of the carb assembly and it is REALLY STICKY. If you move it in and out by hand you can feel the grittiness in the movement.

What can I do to get it moving smoothly?

Thanks.

Tripper

Hi: Tripper

Without removing it from the carb body, try flushing it with carb clean while pulling and pushing it in and out, etc. That should or is likely to remove the grit and or dirt.

If that works, it also means or may indicate the part and the barrel it slides in and out of is not scorn or damaged. Look closely at the choke body once cleaned. May reveal evidence of scratch marks, etc.

If all appears well and seems to work properly...job done. I personall y do not recommend or suggestion any type of lube to be used on the part. Such is making the surfaces more prone to attract and hold dust and or fine dirt particles. Just my opinion.

Good Luck. Sharp Advice.
Master Small Engine Tech. Web Site Host, Forums Monitor and Multiple Topics Moderator. "Accurate Power Equipment Company." Small Engine Diagnostics Services & Repair. Fast...Fair...Friendly & Highly Proficient Services....:D

Thanks for replying so quickly Sharp!

Yeah, I cleaned it with carb cleaner before. It just seems soooo dry. It actually pops in and out instead of smoothly moving in and out and is still kind of gritty. Many times it will bend the linkage rather than move.

I knew better than to just douse it with WD or some other kind of lube, that's why I posted.

What would happen if I did use a lube to try and unstick it?

I appreciate any ideas.

Tripper

Hi: Tripper

The linkage rod may be bent or not well lined up. Link rod may also be weak. The bore of the barrel is most likely slightly enlarged which causes the sloppiness. Same applies to the choke barrel.

In that case, just might have to apply some little lube to get the parts to slide better. WD is not a lube, so to speak. It does clean well. In fact, so well it will wash away most oils and greases.

Thus an alternate type of lube, other than oil is likely to work better. Try silicone spray lube. Even bar soap works. Which can be used on patio door sliders and tracks, if one does not know that trick.

On older engines and in many others cases on any job or project, there often comes a time to do what is best known as "Improvising" a solution to resolve a problem.

Another phrase in the repair trade is:
During installations of some parts which may not fit exactly perfect, it may be necessary to apply "BRUTE" force in order to compel compliance.....:D....:D.....{....just humor folks...:) }

Hello Tripper!

You can get the engine model # which is stamped in the sheet metal engine housing near the cylinder. Let us know that #, or use it to search for the diagram you need on the briggs website.

Tripper:

You can download a manual from the link below. Good luck.

Rogerh

http://shop.briggsandstratton.com/BShopProductListingPage.asp?MecID=100&CatalogID=56B2B9AF-283C-11D4-8886-00B0D0203414&SessionID=503C7FFE-765D-4AC8-A61E-F99FE61A74B5&SMSID=Smart+Search&ViewName=htsDIY&EngineModelNumber=130202&EngineType=0436

A Briggs & Stratton with model # 130202 is 5 Hp.with a horzonal crankshaft,got a microfiche of it in now.email me at mills855@aol.com I'll send you a pic of carb.& part numbers.Sorry I can't help with tractor parts.tho.

How about the engine #'s and I'll provide some part numbers you will likely need to fix the problem. Shouldn't cost too much either.

From the sounds of your original post, you have a pulsa-jet carburetor, not a vacu-jet, unless the engine is 30-something years old (the first two digits of your engines' code will tell you the year). Either way, you mentioned moving the choke "in and out," which indicates you have a barrel-type choke. If so, there are no serviceable parts associated with this type. If a lighweight oil lubricant (machinists' cutting fluid works well) doesn't solve the problem, your only recourse will be carburetor replacement...sorry to say. How 'bout those engine numbers!

For all involved and concerned, I believe this thread is the same as "Pulsa-jet choke sticky..." It is the same author, refer to that thread.

I just realized that the model# was supplied in the original post. Maybe I need glasses... or slow down my reading, lol.

I've got a BS motor 130202 3130

I'm not getting any fuel. I've got good spark and if I pour some gas into the air intake it'll run until that gas is gone and then just die out.

I took the carb and tank off and replaced the fuel pipe. I could blow through it before I put it back on.

I also replaced the suction gasket on the side under the plate. When I had that off I could blow air in one of those little holes and gas would squirt out the other.

I put it back together and made sure I has the spring sat right.

Still nothing! It'll run and then die right out.

Do you have any ideas??

Tripper

Did you clean your carb throughly with Gumout spray cleaner? You must clean out every orfice of that carb. Another thing to check. When you poen it up is ther fuel in the bowl? If there is than you are getting fuel to the carb, if not, than you may have a restriction in the fuel line, or the fuel tank. If you have a fuel filter, I would check to see if it is clean. If it is not, replace it. Let us know how it goes. :)

Terminator is on the money as far as cleaning the carb. However, "Gumout" spray cleaner may not be strong enough if you have heavy varnish build-up. You do not have a bowl or a fuel filter. Your carburetor (a "pulsa-jet type) is mounted directly to the tank. The long plastic tube, on the carburetor, brings fuel from the tank and dumps it into a reservoir (built into the tank). the short aluminum piece extending down into the tank is the actual feed to the venturi. I suggest soaking the carburetor in NAPA Carburetor Cleaner #6401. Use caution when using this cleaner, it is very strong. Safety gloves is a must as well as eye protection. You need to strip the carburetor of any rubber or plastic pieces as this cleaner tends to expand these parts. If you don't feel comfortable doing this you should bring the carburetor to a repair shop and have them recondition it for you. Let us know if you need more assistance!!!

I must be loosing my mind. I thought I posted this but can't find my thread. Oh well, Here goes again.

I have a Briggs Stratton 130202 3130 motor. I does not get any fuel. If I pour a little in the air intake it will run until that is gone and then just die.

I took off the carb and tank. I put a new fuel pipe on the carb and I could blow through it begore I put the carb on the tank.

Also put a new suction diaphram on the side of the carb. When I had that off I shot air through one of the little holes and gas came squirting out the other.

I've checked and rechecked for plugs and can't seem to find any. I am stuck.

Anyone have any suggestions or ideas?

Tripper

You said getting no fuel. Are you sure? When you pull open your carb, do you see alot of fuel in there? And does fuel run out into it when you look at it? It is possible that you have a fuel restriction, or it is possbile that the carb needs to be cleaned really well with Gumout spray to clean all the orfices inside it. Check it out, and clean with automotive gumout spray and let us know how it goes. :)

Thanks for replying Terminator!

Yeah, I've cleaned it real good when I had the carb off with carb cleaner. I'm not sure what you mean when you say 'pull the carb open'.

When the throttle is in the 'wide open' position she is dry as the Sahara.

Is there some other valve that may cause a restriction?

Tripper

Another possibilty is that your carb is not choking the engine when put to choke. If you look inside the carb where the aircleaner is you will see a flapper valve. When you put it to choke it will fully close. If your choke does not close or does not move at all, than it may be stuck. Also, make sure there is nothing blocking the fuel in the fuel line or the gas tank. Try starting it with the gas cap off, if it startes, then the hole in the gas cap may be pluged up. If it is, use a fine needle to remove the gunk, or compressed air. Let us know how it goes. :)

Hello Terminator,

I tried it with the gas cap off the tank and still nothing. I also took out the high speed adjusting screw and blew that out with carb cleaner. It must be clear because the carb cleaner pooled in the air intake.

Like I said, I can dump a little gas in the air intake and she runs fine until that small amount runs out.

I also looked in the gas tank and the pipe seems to be suffiecient height above the tank floor....about 3/8".

Any other ideas?

Tripper

Tripper

That is some good info that terminator20 is giveing.I have an idea tho that is too easily overlooked.In putting the brass fuel tube in the carb.,did you get it in far enough?? What I'm getting at is your engine might be sucking air,and can't suck any gas.

Tripper:
On these engines I have found cracks in the side of the plastic fuel pick up tube in the tank. The tube I am talking about is the one with the screen in the bottom of it. If it has a crack in the side of it, it will suck air before it sucks gas unless you have the tank completly full.
Be sure that screen is clean too.

Rogerh

It sure will..Just like sucking coffee out of a cup with a straw,if you poke a hole in it,you stop getting coffee.

The platsic fuel pipe is new. When I put the copper top back in the carb I put some JB weld around it to seal it good. I'm pretty sure its not sucking air.

Is there somewhere else it could lose suction?

Tripper

Trippers two threads (Trip thought he lost one) are now here for all to help.

Hello,
I posted two threads on 5/3. When I came back to check the first one I couldn't find it. I thought I did something wrong.

I posted another one on the same subject and got a few answers back. I went to check it today and can't find it!

What's going on?

Tripper

Hello; Tripper

The posts (Threads) are still posted in the list of questions.

However, some titles are changed and or edited.
Doing so allows the questions title to be searched more easily.

The question in the title field should indicate the problem. Ans do so in as few words as possible. Those found to be or deemed to be abled to be retitled to more accurately reflect the problem are than edited.

Your prior posts are here:

http://forum.doityourself.com/showthread.php?t=166718

http://forum.doityourself.com/showthread.php?t=165962

Tip:
Look for your member name and not specifically for the words used in the title. Title should reflect the problem. Not the engine brand and or engine serial numbers. They should be used within the text description, within the post.

Commonly asked questions on common problems will or may be compiled and provided as a forum note or used on the web site informational pages. Your questions may be among those used....:)

Regards,
Web Site Host & Forums Monitor.

Sharp Advice,

Thanks for the tips. Sorry for posting them wrong....I just figured that if it had an interesting title, more people would be apt to open it take a look.

Never had a clue there was an etiquette....count me learn'd.

Thanks for sending me my posts.

Actually, if you read the one about the 'no fuel' problem I got a new idea to try from reading your moderator post about basic carb info.

I'm going to check the holes where the carb bolts onto the engine. Maybe they're plugged and preventing a vacuum to occur.

What do you think?

Tripper

I have a Briggs Stratton 130202 3130.

It has a suction carb. The diaphram is readily available on the side of the carb. The old one was bad so I put a new one on.

I'm not getting any fuel. Everything has been flushed and reflushed and I can't see any restriction.

Here's my question: When I took the new diaphram off to check and flush the holes underneath, I noticed that the bottom hole is almost half covered by the diaphram rubber. Not the flap itself but the rubber after the flap.

All other holes match up properly and the top flap seems to match up and fit perfectly.

Should this be?

Tripper

If I understand what your saying the answer is no, the flap is supossed to be over the bottom hole.but after reading your post I started thinking about something.Solit me ask you a qusetionon the other side of the carb.from the diaphragm is there a plate standing up that has two slides on it,the top to orperate the choke,and the bottom to stop the tiller??The reason I ask is to find out if you was sold the wrong diaphragm.You see theirs an "old"and "new"stile the old is270026 the new is272538 an improvement????

Hello Repair Guy,

OK, On the other side of the carb, going from the air intake to where it hooks to the motor: there IS a place for the choke linkage, then the place for the throttle lever to hook on, then near the motor is the place where the governor linkage goes.

Is this enough info?

Is this old or new syle?

Tripper

OOOpps,

Let me add that they are NOT on top of each other. They are side by side.

Tripper

.......and I looked at the print out they used to pull the diaphram and they sold me a 270026

Trip

It would be easier to read your posts if all the information was on the same post. To do this, you simply click on the edit button and add the extra information to the info you already have there instead of creating new posts. I have been told it looks bad to post twice or more in a row. Do you have a manual? If so, see if you have a diaphram part number and post it in here so we can help you. :)


Thanks for the number. We will respond soon!

No, I do not have a manual. I got a print out at the parts store with a blow-up of my motor's carb # 130202 3130.

In the blow-up it says the diaphram is # 270026.
Tripper

Sorry tipper,it took so long to get back to you.Didn't you say that when you had the carb off the feul tank that the carb. had two fuel lines on it,one long and one short??If so thet's the old style carb.and the 270026 diaph.is right,I think that you might have it in wrong.That hole in carb. you was talking should have a flap of diaph.over it,not the solid rubber.And make sure too that you put the spring in the carb.first,then the cup,the diaph.and then the cover.
The carb.has a line-up pin on the engine side.Make sure too that the diaph. doesn't have any tares in it.Not even a screw hole tore out.

Hello: Tripper

Yes. Check the vacuum hole(s) in the carb body and those in the engine blocke where the carb mounts to the block. Not always overlooked but worthy to mention when advising someone to do a carb job. Or when a member states a carb job was done. May have been overlooked.

Carb body vent hole is another as well as breather vent in fuel cap. A cracked fuel line may also draw in air while not leaking fuel out. Lots of small tips that may or may not be the cause of "engine running problems." Or "carb problems."

Often I simply assist and or compliment already existing replies with the odd ball and off the wall possibilities often overlooked and or not sure where checked, etc.

Much of what I learned over the years and taught over the years in small engines and many other types of engine used in any other type of small or large power equipment. Trick is to think "Out Of The Box."......:D

Glad some of the info in my posted thread was of interest to you. Hope it is to others as well. Sharing, we all learn more........:)

BTW:
Your questions often are of interests. No additional effort, on your part needed, to attrack attention. You do well. All questions get personal attention by each professional in this topic and every topic on this web site.

Regards & Good Luck. Sharp Advice.
Master Small Engine Tech. Web Site Host, Forums Monitor and Multiple Topics Moderator. "Accurate Power Equipment Company." Engine Diagnostics Services & Repair. Fast...Fair...Friendly & Highly Proficient Services....:D

Thanks Repair Guy,

I think I got the wrong diaphram. I'll check it out tomorrow.

I'll let you know. Thanks again.

Tripper

TRIPPER AND ALL INVOLVED AND CONCERNED:
THERE HAS NOW BEEN THREE THREADS STARTED REGARDING THIS SUBJECT. IT WILL BE VERY EASY TO BECOME CONFUSED, ON TRIPPERS PART, IF THIS CONTINUES. PLEASE REFER TO TRIPPERS (NOW ONLY OTHER) THREAD ENTITLED "engine running problem"...PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE!!!

Yow, from Terminator in Washington to Puey in upstate NY...I've upset the applecart from coast to coast!

Sorry guys. It sure wasn't on purpose. I've learned my lesson.

Thanks for your patience.

Tripper

Hello Repair guy,

When you say fuel lines are you talking about fuel pipes? This carb has only one fuel pipe going into the tank. It also has a small brass rod about 2.5" long on the bottom of the carb that goes through a hole in the gasket and goes into the tank. In the middle there is a protrusion that is about 3/8" in diameter and about 3" long that has what looks like a welch plug in the bottom of it. It also has a pin that is flush next to the welch plug and another pin on the side. Not sure what these are.

Tripper

Sorry bout my choice of names.What I ment was did your carb have one brass pipe with a plastic fuel line on it.(longer).And a shorter (screw in plastic pipe.If so your carb. is a old type and the part # for the diaphragm is 270026.
Which I think (going by what you've said so far).You must have this diaphragm in wrong,that hole is not supossed to be covered up by the solid rubber.Both flaps of the diaph.goes towards the choke side if well it covers.

Hello Repair Guy,

I may be missing the 'short' fuel pipe. I do have the 'long' one; a brass piece with the plastic end on it but do not have another shorter one.

I'm sure you're corect when saying it is an 'old' type. I got one of the other diaphrams and it is different. I'm sure its in right.

Tripper

Hello; Tripper

I combined (merged) all the prior posts you made on this same engine problem, into one thread, for ease of reading and following along. And here it is.

Even doing that and rereading the entire thread, confusion still exists, to me at least. Seems it all started in the original post back on page one. There you used the words "pipes" into the fuel tank from the carb.

That single word (pipe verus pipes) pipe is singular meaning one pipe and pipes is plural, meaning two or more, in my opinion, created all the confusion, as to the type of carb it is. Vac-u-jet or pulse-jet. Big difference.

Both carb types explained well by all concerned parties posting replies. But appears to me the professionals picked up and keyed in on that single word, thus creating some of the confusion.

More confusion created with terms. Lines versus pipes. Lines are fuel lines, as in hoses, as an example and pipes are metal or plastic tubes, those extending from the carb downwards into the fuel tank.

Hope that clears up some of the confusions.

Now, in my opinion, what needs to be known is:
Where there two >pipes< or one >pipe< extending down from the carb prior to disassembly?

Does not matter, at this point, whether either are plastic or metal. Just trying to determine how many there are. One or two?

If there was only one, that indicates the carb type, as well as if there >is< or >where< two pipes. Once that is known, unless I missed that point here, determines the carb type and whether the gasket is the correct one, etc.

Been many years since I serviced such carbs. Best as I can remember, the two gaskets are visably different and cannot be interchanged, by simply looking. One will notice the difference immediately.

When you said:
"In the middle there is a protrusion that is about 3/8" in diameter and about 3" long that has what looks like a welch plug in the bottom of it."

In the middle where????

Of the carbs underside? (Where the gasket goes?)

On the side of the carb??? (Near the gasket cover?)

Next, you state:
"It also has a pin that is flush next to the welch plug and another pin on the side."

What is IT? Explain IT?

Next you state:
"Not sure what these are." (Pins?)

And neither am I and neither may the rest of us.

>>>Kindly explain all the above.<<<

Thanks.

Trying to decipher the above (terms & phrases used) and all the statements and descriptions made in this entire thread.

BTW:
After all this....I think I need a "Drink"...:)...."Coffee" that is....:D CYA.

Did you get it fixed? :)

Yes Sir! Just came in from tilling just now! Runs like a champ.

Just want to thank everyone involved in this long confusing thread. Sorry for the inconvenience.

When the threads got merged it only added to confusion because the 'Wonder Boy' thread was a totally different motor than the tiller motor. Just happened that they were both BS 5hp motors with very similar numbers.

This tilling motor actually had about four things wrong or plugged in the fuel system. All the advice was great. Thanks again!

Tripper

Glad you got it fixed!!! :)