Doors and Windows - Window Shopping

Has anyone out there heard of Cardinal Excel vinyl replacement windows or vinyl windows made by "Sun". They both have websites but not alot of info on them. I have received estimates from two different installers who say they are good quality windows. I live in Illinois and pricewise a certainteed replacement window from local lumber yard for a 30x58 is about $210.00 (install myself). thats with thermaflect, argon, grilles, and lower screen. The two mentioned above range 160.00 to 180.00 add 85.00 for install. I am leaning toward spending the extra for certainteed but I do have 18 windows which will amount to about 1000.00 more. Any advice?

The Certainteed window that the lumberyard is offering is a builders grade window. Nothing wrong with that, has a pretty decent warranty, and will last a long time.

The Cardinal and Sun windows -- must be regional brands -- never heard of them here in CA. Nothing wrong with that, either -- I have access to brands you will never hear of also. That is just the way the window industry is.

How do the warranties between the 3 brands compare? We know about Certainteed -- they are going to be there if you ever have a warranty issue, or even a problem after the warranty has long since expired. What about the other 2? New companies? Old companies? How about the installers? Been around a long time, or just setting up shop? (Even "just setting up shop" isn't necessarily bad -- what about their experience??)

Some of the best contractors (in various fields) around here have only been in business for themselves for 4 or 5 years, but they have a lot of good background and training behind them. Maybe they got tired of the way the other guy was doing it -- maybe the other guy just retired.

The other two windows have decent warrantys but like you said will they be around for a long time. The cardinal exel seems to be a pretty good window and claims to have been around since the 50's. I think I am going with certainteed. I may have a carpenter friend assist me in installing them myself. What is the best way to insulate the window weight space? I have been told to blow insulation in to the pulley opening to fill the space up after I take out the window weights. If I do it myself I will do a few windows at a time over a month or two and really would rather not rent a blower each time I do a few windows. What type of insulation is best and easiest to use and is there a good way to fill that space without a blower? I really do not want to take the inside trim off since it is oak and stained and nailed in to plaster walls. Any suggestions appreciated.

Just fill the space with pieces of fiberglass batts as you go. I agree that blown would be better, but you are dealing with such a small amount of space, that the difference would be negligable. Fiberglass will be much simpler -- just use the right "R" value, (R-13 for 2X4 cavities, R-19 for 2X6 cavities), and don't pack it in. F'glass needs its 'fluff to work properly.

I thought about doing that but thought it might be difficult to try to feed the batt insulation up into the 1 1/2 wide by 6" sash weight panel door opening. The opening in the upper frame where the pulley is even smaller. My windows are 58" height so I have a long span to push the insulation up into and seems it might be a job to get it in there without packing it in. Do you have to cut a larger opening?

I understand you don't want to pull the trim off of the inside of the weight chase -- plaster walls, etc., I fully agree. But can't you pull the cover off from the outside and install the insulation?? I have yet to run into a double hung where it wasn't possible to do that -- but then, I've only replaced about a thousand or so of them. (Got a ways to go before I see them all!)

Lefty, trust me....you'll NEVER see it all......jeez....I did one last Friday that was the most cobbled up mess of an excuse for windows I ever saw.....took me two days to do 11 dadgum windows....

Somebody had taken some old sashes and put them in some homemade "frames" ( and I'm being generous to call them that) and apparently only had a slight clue on what a window was supposed to look like......of course the house was the same deal.......looked like a remodeled chicken coop.

I'm not a big fan of building codes and especially the knucklehead inspectors that enforce them, but this was a posterchild pic of where people ought to be protected from their own stupidity.


Dan:

Do what Lefty said......pop the outside casing off and THERE are your window weights and cavity. Since I'm covering the outside with aluminum trim coil, I don't worry about being too carefull with the wood from an appearance standpoint, but you can do it careful and just repaint if you're not covering. GREAT tool for this is a little Stanley "wonderbar"......small, ( bout 8" long ) chrome looking pry bar that is strong as the dickens....I've have to quit doing this if I lost mine and couldn't get another. Great little bar for removing mouldings without damage. Lowes or HomeDepot's or about any hardware that carries Stanley stuff.

Andy, I'm sure I never will see it all. There have simply been too many of the knuckleheads going ahead of me doing what they do, and the 'creativity' some of them use is amazing.


Dan,

The Stanley wonder bar Andy mentions IS an essential tool. There are at least 3 or 4 of them on my truck at all times. If you are going to reuse and repaint the exterior trim board, start by cutting the painted joint with a razor knife before you start prying the board off. There are probably 10 or 15 layers of paint on it.

I have a brick bungelow and I have 3 windows side by side in my living room, dining, room and both bedrooms. I can pull the 2 exterior cover boards off from the windows in the center. The outer sash weights on either side of the 3 windows I would have no access. Guess you would just go through the sash weight panel door to insulate them. I also am thinking of installing the windows from the outside instead of removing my inner trim boards. I will nail a 1x2 around the frame where the exterior stops were at. Then wrap it all in aluminum. have you used this method before?

Ya, in thinking back, I have occassionally run into some old weighted type windows that have a "cove" sorta moulding on the sides in brick, and don't have the big wide trim board you generally find, and the weights ARE NOT accessable from the outside on the sides....that must be what you have......

In that case, if you don't want to pull the inside casing, you could knock or pry the pulley out after you get the sashes out and fill the side cavities with a LATEX foam.....get the DAP brand that is made for doors/windows and remains pillow soft after you shoot it.....not the "great stuff" polyeurathane kind that expands all to heck and hardens like a rock. The latex kind won't put any pressure on your jambs.

You definitely can put them in from the outside.....I usually do if the inside is painted up just to keep from disturbing the paint.

You'll be cutting the storm stop off on the sides with a chisel....you don't need to take the top off......I don't bother to replace it with anything, your screw are securing the new frame, so it really doesn't serve any purpose to replace the stop. I then caulk or insulate the gap between the new replacement frame and the old jamb, then cap with aluminum trim.